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"Teacher · 03-11-2005, 06:22 AM

We are replacing a rusty windshield frame. We have purchased a complete cowl section from which we are removing the upper cowl extension to replace the old cowl and dash section. I hope to use the pillars and frame, but where do I cut it? The section came with about a foot of the roof behind the pillars. It loos like the easiest thing would be to cut the pillars right at the upper corners, where it looks they were joined from the factory. But I would like to replace the windshield upper frame as well. Should we cut along the upper frame, where it joins the roof, or perhaps replace it from the joint about 6" back from the frame, with the old roof sheetmetal overlapping the new? Any pics of one that has been done? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

"Teacher · 03-11-2005, 06:22 AM

We are replacing a rusty windshield frame. We have purchased a complete cowl section from which we are removing the upper cowl extension to replace the old cowl and dash section. I hope to use the pillars and frame, but where do I cut it? The section came with about a foot of the roof behind the pillars. It loos like the easiest thing would be to cut the pillars right at the upper corners, where it looks they were joined from the factory. But I would like to replace the windshield upper frame as well. Should we cut along the upper frame, where it joins the roof, or perhaps replace it from the joint about 6" back from the frame, with the old roof sheetmetal overlapping the new? Any pics of one that has been done? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

mike nixon · 03-11-2005, 11:22 AM

the last one i was involved in doing this to was done as follows. we separated the pillars from the roof section. pita and time consuming as there are 3-4 layers of metal in the joint.

we then trimmed and test fitted the new section,x'd out the window opening and made sure the door openings were still right.

before you start removing the pillars /roof section be sure the car is supported on a hard level surface. even with the frame attached the body will tweak if it's not supported.

after we were confident everything was right we tacked the asm into place and rechecked all the measurements before the final welds.

personally i wouldn't section the roof as you've mentioned. if the channel's unrepairable i'd reskin it.

mike

"Teacher · 03-11-2005, 12:21 PM

So your are saying we should bolt the doors back on the car to test it when it's been tacked, but not welded? Got it. Reskinning: Would that intail grinding out the clip studs and then removing just the channel skin from the new cowl, and then putting that over the old channel, or removing the channel itself and welding the new channel in? How about removing most of the old channel, leaving about 1/4" below the roof line and 1/4" above the lower part to be able to weld and still grind the inside of the channel?

mike nixon · 03-15-2005, 10:25 PM

we didn't bolt the doors back on. we measured out he door jamb before and after the replacement. the doors fit well on this car.

the reskinning i mentioned was the roof skin. i personally wouldn't seam a roof like you've mentioned above.

re the lower channel area. if the orig firewall is in good shape why not just replace the dash area? it's held in under the windsheild channel area by spot welds and should bolt in at the lower portion of the dash.

the upper channel is part of the roof skin. i suppose you could replace it as you've mentioned, i never thought of doing it that way i guess. i've either made patches, closed up the holes or put a new roof skin on.

if you do it as you've suggested remember the stud will need to be welded back onto the channel.

mike

"Teacher · 03-16-2005, 05:26 AM

Actually we are cutting the pillar posts at the top and replacing the dash area and upper cowl skin from dash to firewall, keeping the firewall. This will fix 98% of the rust problem. Then I will put some sections in the spot on top where it is bad (about 3" or so) and seal the rest of the surface rust with a POR 15 type product.Then We'll use some metal filler on the pitted areas along the top that are still pretty solid. Does this sound acceptable? Would you buy a car that was repaired this way?

mike nixon · 03-17-2005, 10:46 AM

if the repair's done correctly i would have no problem with it.

as an fyi, i don't like the por-15 products. do a search in this forum for pro's and cons of it before deciding on it.

i'd also blast all of the surface rust out of the area that i could and then use a self etching prime or epoxy after the needed repairs.

the biggest thing on these old cars and repair work is to do it right the first time.

in your position this is the perfect example to train the students right the first time so they can carry that knowlege on with them.

btw i'm glad to see you fixing this car and not parting it out.

mike

george kujanski · 03-17-2005, 10:52 AM

WHERE ARE THE DARN PICTURES??????????

George

"Teacher · 03-17-2005, 08:28 PM

Thank you , Mike. I intend to teach the kids right, and do a first-rate job. That is one reason I frequent these boards so often. I have a Nason Epoxy primer, but am saving it until the body can be blasted. First we are treating the hard to reach surface rust areas that the blaster cannot get to (Underside of dash, cowl pockets, heat duct areas, ect.). To do this we are sanding by fingertip the areas with 50 Grit, then 80, then painting on the Permatex rust treatment: 3 coats, and then primer and semi-gloss black enamel. After the upper cowl section and trunk/package tray area are sectioned in, we will take it the blaster for soda or walnut shell blasting. At this point the only thing that will be on the car in the way of outward sheetmetal will be the roof. We have removed the trunk and floors so the frame will be easy to access for blasting.

George,
My student photographer was reassigned this week, so he is hard to reach right now. I tried to lower the MB on the photos myself, but can't seem to do it. I have no "photoshop" program, and all the pics are on cd. each pic is 62 to 80 MB.I tried cutting and pasting into Word Document to see if that would help (Nope!), then I did the same with MS Publisher (made them twice as big).If you have any ideas, I can email the photos to you and you could try to shrink them. The send them back via email as smaller documents. Whattaya think?

karl emerick · 03-17-2005, 09:10 PM

sounds like a great project...
my .02
If you don't put the doors back on I'd consider welding a brace between the A-pillar and the rear door jamb. and then weld a 'T' up to the top just to make sure it doesn't move. if you do hang the doors I'd weld a 'T' from the door to the top for the same purpose - unless of course it's a post car which would simplify your life. make sure you weld all the 'layers' of the window frame for strength even if you have to remove a small rectangular piece of the outerframe to access the inner support layers. you never know if someone will (god forbid !) 'roll it'

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:22 AM

If all goes right, this is a picture of me and two students with the car when we first got it.

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:33 AM

Ah! Okay, here is a pic of the car without right rear q-panel, after being taken down to the bare bones.

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:35 AM

Now this one is of the nasty cowl...

george kujanski · 03-18-2005, 10:37 AM

60 to 80 MB? That's giant size. You sure that's right?

What file format are those? As far as I know, you can only post a bitmap (.bmp) or a JPEG (.jpg). If you are using TIFF, that's certainly bigger.

I shoot and store mine as .jpg files, they are about 800K (2048 X 1768) resolution.

Try the software that came with the camera, or any camera software, to resize. All the software handles .jpg or bitmaps.

I use Olympus Camedia software. It has a resize function built right in.

In the lobby you need to resize it to 60K max., a resolution of about 500 X 300 or so should get you close. For the other forums 800 X 600 will post.

Never mind, looks like you've got it.

george

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:38 AM

This is Freshman Ryan Richards cutting out the floor.

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:41 AM

Right side floor removed for replacement.Notice that the pillars are also missing.

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:46 AM

Cowl-less. We're almost down to no car!

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:46 AM

Trunk with floor cut out.Notice that the supports are not too bad.

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:49 AM

Enough stripping! This is the cowl we got to replace the bad one.

"Teacher · 03-18-2005, 10:57 AM

Our first pro active step. Setting in the new cowl. It was a pain to remove just the top skins from both the new and old cowl, but I think it will prove out as worth it in the end. More pics on the way as we make more steps. Interesting, though, that my Freshmen are more enthusaistic about the project, which is why you probably won't see the Junior and Senior students in the pics. The Frosh want to work on this car, and want to be around when it is finished! They have dubbed the car "'Ol Crusty". But the student who took the pics has a poster of an Orbit orange Judge convertible, which the freshman saw. They can already see "ol Crusty" in that car's paint and trim (except the top of course). On another thread, I took a poll regarding the color combo. After watching the hard work of my freshmen class (and as a possible motivator to the juniors), I let them pick the colors.....Orbit Orange with Black interior.

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