[GTOWAGON]

I have no involvement in this at all but after reading this thread and the one in the buisness section i have to ask what did Bryan Jensen do that was worse than what Mr cox did? will he also be banned for life from this site? if not it seems that there is a double standard here

[bird72]

It seems the Pontiac "Brotherhood" may be a bit tarnished and unstable.....

The Pontiac Sisterhood, on the other hand, makes me damn proud after reading these posts. God Bless you ladies and your strength and honesty is awe inspiring. Good Luck in righting this situation.

[Brian Baker]

There's nothing wrong with the "brotherhood". We too come out and shine light on shysters when neccessary. Trouble is, sometimes, some of us get our pee-pee's whacked for doing so...being told we're being "mean" and "vindictive".

[DAV137]

If keeping a deposit since the end of Sept and keeping money from parts sales since the beginning of August is not " intentionally holding money", then I don't know what is. I am so sorry that this has gotten so nasty. Ray can explain his butt into the ground for all I care. He as not been totally honest with me and that is that. If I had not gone over to his house this past week, I can guarantee you all that I still would not have the money. I am mad over the welder, I had a buyer and now I have to start all over again. To him, that may mean nothing, but to me it means alot. He is not the victim here, but I am sure he wants everyone to think he is.

[Phil Goat Nelson]

At this point, it would seem that Ray not only has to make good on whatever "loose ends" are still out there, but to step up to the plate and do something that makes things "right" once and for all. Otherwise, no acts or words from him will really be meaningful. Good Luck Ray, I don't envy you.

[Blackcat]

You go Girl!

My father said this to me after Grandma's funeral. (Sarcasticly)
"Death brings out the best in people"

I learned first had that you never let people that claim they can be trusted handle things.
My uncle died and Instead of handleing it my self I let my two sisters have my power of attourny handling the estate.
When it was done they both had charged 100's of dollars against the estate. and I recieved just a pitance of what his estate was worth.
My sisters?
Both bought new homes!

I find this really sad that You had to go to this to get your money.
I pray that It is rsolved with you getting your money.

[herdswoman]

Greyson, same here. Darcie and I were on the phone for over an hour.

You've seen me talk a little smack, and hopefully you've seen me help several people. You've never seen me be mean or want to take someone down.

Until now.

I hope rtzkd managed those donations from beginning to end and they never saw the black hole that is Ray Cox's Pay Pal account.

Ray, if we "are all thinking bad", it's because it IS bad. Or is it that the rest of the world is crazy and you are the only sane one?

Your track record speaks for itself.

Do you know what the worst is, Ray?
It's not the cheating, the excuses, the delaying or the lying.

YOU MADE DARCIE FEEL ALONE, ABANDONED AND MISS HER DEAD HUSBAND MORE THAN EVER.

You ripped those scabs off those wounds. You've hurt her and made her cry more than once. You've provoked her until she felt she had no recourse - except to come to the family where she felt there was some integrity, where people came to her when she was in need without getting in her business.

And when the men she turned to felt that the male chromosomes might needed to be balanced out with female help, they called me. I called her. Several strageties were laid out and she chose the path she wanted to go down.

Looks like she's doin' Larry proud.

It's all firsthand information. All fact. I have never lied to anyone on this board, never self-promoted, never had my own agenda. My record speaks for itself as well.

[mike nixon]

Originally Posted by ponchoshop

Hate when this **** happens. I must be in the dark...again.

Darcy, i will post what facts i know.
If thier not true, pm me, and i will go pound sand in Ray's ass!

He called me many times asking how much were Larry's car, truck, compressor, welder, tools, etc, were worth, and what be the best way to get top $ fast since you had a house and two car payments due.
I told him the last thing to do is have a garage sale cause all the vultures would swoop down and pick you clean.

He had me come over to look at some tools in the barn to discuss what they would be worth.
Turned out they were already gone(missing according to Ray) along with the tool box from Larry's truck, and some tools out of the Garage.
I have been to Ray's and in his trailer. Other then the welder, i have seen nothing of Larry's.

Now about the other car. If anything is false, Pitch400 will have to post.
Pitch payed Ray to deliver the TA.
Ray called me while he was there to ask if i or anyone near us would be interested in a fairly clean 68 GTO.
I said hell ya, i've been passing on 68-9's for 20 some years. Bring it back, and if it needs more work then i want to deal with, we'l find a buyer.
Well, Ray being the Pontiac car whore he is(arnt we all), decided to keep it and sell his 67FB convertible instead.
The GTO is in my backyard. I'm looking straight out at it as i type, and have the $ in hand in case Pitch needs to sell it now. But Ray has 1st dibb's.
So i can say he's not try'n to make a profit on it.

so mike, how about you pay pitch for the car and then ray can pay you if he ever gets the money? this way the rightful owner's been taken care of and you're not an accessory if it gets that far.

mike

[Region Warrior]

[QUOTE=Brian Baker]Wow!:(


I drive to Langer's home in Philly, a little over a 2 hour drive for me, to get the heads. Heads are there, but no rockers or stud girdles. John says those weren't given to him. No problem, I'll have Ray ship them. I take a quick look at the heads, and the intake ports seem awful small. So I ask John, "Do they look like they've had a Butler race port done on them to you?" and John replied "No, in fact they don't look like they've been touched". I bring them home. They have Butler markings on them, so I know they at least came from Butler.

I call Butler to find out more about the heads. David confirms that they worked on them, but they're not a race port, they're the 300-cfm port that they advertise for $2200 ready to bolt on, and mine flowed 307-cfm at .700" lift. In other words, all they had done to them was a bowl clean up. Definately not what Ray had advertised.

I understand Ray sold those heads and parts to his friend Mike, who also frequents this board. I haven't heard any public complaints, so I assume Mike was happy with them.

If thier the same heads, i still have them along with the rockers.
But they are not a simple bowl clean up as Butler stated.
They in fact flow 315 intake(2.19). Forgot the exhaust flow.
And been trimmed to 66 cc's.
Had them flowed by a guy up in Il., along with one of Butlers wide ports.
Dont know this guy personnelly, but he had at least one of every Pontiac block, head, and intake made in his shop.
His pick was mine over the wideport due to inversion @ 650 lift.
1 rocker needs replacing. 2 more need gone thru to make sure thier ok.
I did not buy the girdles.

Maybe not what you expected off a 8.90/160 mph car.

[PONTIAC DUDE]

Brian. That story sure has mellowed out since the time that deal went down.


And if I remember correctly from our conversation back then, he wasn't, as you say........ that receptive? ......... and said 'he wanted' it all back or nothing and his tone was different then you now state?

Racing while still owing money. You list is way to short.

Lot more bad info out there.

He's knows who he owes and what he needs to do.

Shame Darcie had to do what she had to do to get him off his A$$ and start to make it right.

Same deal with the 1050cfm $300.00 CHEAP carb. I Had to say I would buy the carb that Lil Jack sold to him 2 years ago to get him to pay Lil' Jack at Norwalk.

Ray. Hammer me for taking time off and not racing. But I paid and pay my debts incured during rough times down here after the huricanes and other issues.

Ya need to take a lesson in life. Your not a Professional Racer.
Take care of Business first, Play Later.


But I'm done. Not worth the Brain Space anymore.

[Region Warrior]

I forgot about the parts from Norwalk.
He had to move out of his shop when the owner sold the property.
They are still on the trailer in a U-Store-It garage in Valpo.

[Region Warrior]

Originally Posted by mike nixon

so mike, how about you pay pitch for the car and then ray can pay you if he ever gets the money? this way the rightful owner's been taken care of and you're not an accessory if it gets that far.

mike

Just got off the phone with Pitch.
Getting the title from Ray tomarrow and sending the money this week.

Finallly a GTO owner.
Who'da thought it after owning FB's for 31yrs :D

[Brian Baker]

It's been two years...I've had time to mellow over it. It was when he said all or nothing that the heads went back and he refunded my money.

Mike, as to what they flowed, I'm only repeating what David Butler read to me from his records. They still are not what they were advertised as. As to the rockers, I wouldn't use any of them, the trunions on all of them are rough, but that's your choice. To each his own.

[PONTIAC DUDE]

Poncho. Did Ray ever pay ya the $2500 more or less you posted one time he owed ya over a year ago on parts, cranks, etc?

Did ya get the 421 #990 crank he broke of yours deal straighten out with Ray yet? :(

Hope so. Hard to find those anymore.

[herdswoman]

That is most convenient. If the parts are still on a trailer, it will make it very easy to deliver to Darcie TODAY.

[PONTIAC DUDE]

Originally Posted by ponchoshop

Just got off the phone with Pitch.
Getting the title from Ray tomarrow and sending the money this week.

Finallly a GTO owner.
Who'da thought it after owning FB's for 31yrs :D

Glad everything worked out for Craig.

[mike nixon]

mike , my opinion of you is that you're a stand up guy. i'm glad craig's getting taken care of so that issue's settled.

welcome to the gto club.

mike

[David Holmberg]

Originally Posted by ponchoshop

Just got off the phone with Pitch.
Getting the title from Ray tomarrow and sending the money this week.

Finallly a GTO owner.
Who'da thought it after owning FB's for 31yrs :D

Congrats Mike, you've always been an honorable guy, welcome to the GTO family.

[Tom Vaught]

I met Mike at Larry's funeral and aside from being a "power drinker" (like I once was, LOL), he struck me as a very straight up kind of person. A Lot of Volunteer Firemen are like that.

Congrats on your new purchase. Keep on Ray's butt until he gives you the title and then get the money to Craig as soon as possible. He has been waiting awhile apparently, as have others.

Quote:

"And when the men she turned to felt that the male chromosomes might needed to be balanced out with female help, they called me."

This comment still bothers me.

If I read this right, someone is implying that Party A tried to take advantage of Party B in more ways than financial ones. That would be VERY DISTURBING to me.

Please tell me that that is not what I am reading.

Tom V.

[dancolkate]

It was great to see this Pontiac community come together to help Darcie.

God knows she did not deserve this.

But the way most of you are going about this is all wrong. The public bashing of another human being has gone on here since I've joined and is the reason I'm out of here. Even the moderators have joined in this time. Another sad day for PY. There are other ways to handle it.

All Darcie wanted to do was publicly disasociate herself from another member. She did not ask for all your opinions and stories and unsolicited help. YOU have made it worse.

GTOWAGON wrote:
I have no involvement in this at all but after reading this thread and the one in the buisness section i have to ask what did Bryan Jensen do that was worse than what Mr cox did? will he also be banned for life from this site? if not it seems that there is a double standard here.

Well GTOWAGON, you are an intellegent person.

God Bless you Darcie, I hope you're able to find peace and forgiveness in Larry's death as well as all this BS.