#1  
Old 05-03-2020, 10:34 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default New test and tune

So last night Baytown had a 20-30 car track rental. It cooled off from 90 to high 70s DA was about 1650-1700.
Changes to the car were swapping the true 850 Demon in that had been on the old roller motor 455 in the 78 TA that went 10.90s and 1.52 60 fts in it and it weighed 3750 vs the 3595 the Camaro weighs. I had a larger venturi 4150 on it and since the 60s and 1/8 have just seemed off felt maybe the carb was a little lazy.A dded a vacuum pump so not getting oil out the breathes fixed header leak that melted down starter battery cable last outing. Last outing was first one with the 5000 convertor from the 455 TA to try and help 60s. It did from 1.7s to 1.6s. But still not where it should be. So some good improvements but 2 steps forward and one back with new issues. This car is "snake bit"!

Previous best was a 10.80 and best mph 127. First run was with air cleaner as all previous runs. Second run tried a burnout with the line lock and still feels like they do not spin well but my brake pressure gauges only show pressure on fronts. So something in the brake system or tranny. But when I just buzz the tires out of the water and shift it everything seems good,And it actually did spin for the first time and finally a 60 in the 1.5s. Buddy said front came up quick then dropped and unloaded rear so probably need to adjust front shock settings. Actaully shifted late at 7000 1-2, but did a weird deal at 6500 in second pulling hard quit pulling as hard blipped quickly to 7000, shift the 3rd and pulled hard again. Tranny was a little low on fluid even though I've check it numerous times since the convertor swap. So tranny 2nd gear issue, ignition. Heck tach going out, sometimes just blipping the throttle to 3000 the shift light set at 6500 comes on.

Last run just buzzed tires on the burnout. Spun a gain. Made sure I shifted at 6500 and hardly had a noticeable blip in top of second. I had forgotten to turn on the electric fans for that run so maybe they were pulling too much juice for the DUI HEI that 2nd run? Buddy said it sounded good and he did not hear a miss. Going to download the data logger later today.

But finally much better 60ft times and mph going the right way. Just never had a car with so many issues.

And everyone was socially distancing until about the time I was going to leave when a guy on a brand new Honda 450 Enduro(paper plates still) lost it and he and bike were sliding on the pavement in front of my truck! He did not have his helmet strap fastened so it popped off and he face planted and was out for a minute or so. So I had to pick the bike off him while others slowly rolled him over supporting his neck until EMTs looked him over. He kind of blew them off and just wanted to go home nearby. Not sure if alcohol was a factor or the 450 has too much power and he goosed it and hit some gravel in the pits.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC_0285.jpg
Views:	194
Size:	40.6 KB
ID:	539019  

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #2  
Old 05-03-2020, 10:56 AM
shaker455's Avatar
shaker455 shaker455 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NH
Posts: 4,365
Default

Crazy! That is racing
Sometimes good other right back on the trailer!
Nice job helping the guy Skip

__________________
Carburetor building & modification services
Servicing the Pontiac community over 20 years
  #3  
Old 05-03-2020, 12:24 PM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

Hard to believe a 14x4 air cleaner made that much difference!

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #4  
Old 05-03-2020, 12:56 PM
shaker455's Avatar
shaker455 shaker455 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NH
Posts: 4,365
Default

Yep, straightens the air out

__________________
Carburetor building & modification services
Servicing the Pontiac community over 20 years
  #5  
Old 05-03-2020, 01:18 PM
PAUL K's Avatar
PAUL K PAUL K is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Sugar Grove IL USA
Posts: 4,873
Default

Glad to see you are making progress Skip and hopefully having some fun.

__________________
Go fast, see Elvis!
www.facebook.com/PaulKnippensMuscleMotors
  #6  
Old 05-03-2020, 04:05 PM
Scott Stoneburg's Avatar
Scott Stoneburg Scott Stoneburg is online now
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,835
Default

Nice improvements, from 10.80 to 10.35..awesome! The MPH is enough to get you into the 9s once you get the 60' down.

  #7  
Old 05-03-2020, 05:28 PM
Scott65's Avatar
Scott65 Scott65 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 1,486
Default

Skip, have you tried a Dominator on it?

__________________
'65 Tempest 467 3650# 11.30@120.31
  #8  
Old 05-04-2020, 03:18 AM
Dragncar Dragncar is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Humbolt County California
Posts: 6,637
Default

Nice job ! I think you will be needing to get the 9.99 and under license. Have a physical in your future.

  #9  
Old 05-04-2020, 10:47 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

Scott we did on the dyno with the 2" taper adapter and no difference but that was before Jeff reworked it, so may be in the future. Should have the hood clearance. Even with the 3" cowl the Victor is close to the hood. Had to use the 2" L-88 drop base to fit an air cleaner.

So here is the data logs. Only one run got picked up. Starter after I staged came over and asked if I wanted a standard or pro tree and I had already triggered it. Then one run I forgot to. You can see a"double hump" in the 2-3 engine and smaller at the driveshaft and a little in the Gs on the second copy where I blew it up and put it in the upper screen.

Battery did stay 13.5 whole run so probably that was not an issue. Fuel pressure was only 4. I have two gauges and they are 2lbs difference the lower reads the same as the logger so I bumped them up until it is 7lbs.

The wildest thing I saw racing was a full tube chassis Late Vette body diesel! He was trying to set some new record. When it did a burn out is was so violent with bottom end TQ you would have thought it would rip up the pavement!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	May 2 Baytown Data logger.jpg
Views:	81
Size:	72.4 KB
ID:	539111   Click image for larger version

Name:	May Baytown Data 2.jpg
Views:	70
Size:	71.2 KB
ID:	539112  

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #10  
Old 05-04-2020, 11:26 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

Vacuum pump pulled about 1.5 oz(45 ml) since installation and these 3 runs.

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #11  
Old 05-04-2020, 01:00 PM
TinInjun's Avatar
TinInjun TinInjun is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: American by birth, Southerner by the grace of God
Posts: 1,323
Default

Look at your 1st gear fuel ratio's. You are going way lean at the launch. Doesn't level out until 2nd gear. This could be why the car is so soft down low. Almost looks like to pump is not keeping up with the G's at launch, then catches back up when everything gets rolling.

__________________
Less said,,,,,,,, Less mended.
  #12  
Old 05-04-2020, 01:07 PM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

I could not see a spin where driveshaft goes up more than engine but buddy felt it was .

I'll double check wide band on original I think I clicked it off for these screen shots. Looked like 11s to mid 12s.

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #13  
Old 05-04-2020, 01:49 PM
TinInjun's Avatar
TinInjun TinInjun is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: American by birth, Southerner by the grace of God
Posts: 1,323
Default

The second picture appears to have the wide band data. Hard to be exactly sure as the picture is small and not so clear.

__________________
Less said,,,,,,,, Less mended.
  #14  
Old 05-04-2020, 02:25 PM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

Yea I'll check the main graph. I can add or delete the info on the graph. The lower part is hard to see. The Gs when they were down low almost looked like a straight line.

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #15  
Old 05-05-2020, 12:26 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

Here is wide band over engine rpm, driveshaft below and fuel pressure bottom of graph. There is some fluctuation of wide band mid 1st
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Wide band O2 May Baytown.jpg
Views:	83
Size:	73.6 KB
ID:	539194  

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #16  
Old 05-05-2020, 06:09 AM
455-4+1's Avatar
455-4+1 455-4+1 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,322
Default

The bumps in 02 seem to correspond to the bumps in fuel pressure.
Looks like something may be up with pump or regulator from that.
Is it a bypass or a dead head, bypass pressure log should nearly be flat / smooth regardless of rpm or engine demand if operating correctly
Some numbers on the o2 scale would be handy, can you do a screen dump with just o2 graph showing scale and expand a bit vertically so we can see what's going on.

__________________
Working on going faster (and now staying dry at the same time !!)
  #17  
Old 05-05-2020, 09:11 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

I'll try that. Bypass regulator, and you can see manual gauge needle bouncing a little. When using the logger real time it is bouncing maybe 1/2 lb.

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #18  
Old 05-05-2020, 11:02 AM
Larry Navarro's Avatar
Larry Navarro Larry Navarro is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Spring(Houston) Tx. USA
Posts: 6,366
Default

Impressive Skip!

__________________
Home of WFO Hyperformance Shaker induction.
  #19  
Old 05-05-2020, 11:29 AM
Skip Fix's Avatar
Skip Fix Skip Fix is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Katy,TX USA
Posts: 19,258
Default

SO you tranny gurus would any tranny issue in 2nd do a little quick slip only at the top of second? Alhough the driveshaft rpm seems to mirror the same blip.

__________________
Skip Fix
1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever!
1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand
1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project
2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4
1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project
1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs
  #20  
Old 05-05-2020, 12:50 PM
Scott65's Avatar
Scott65 Scott65 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 1,486
Default

Based on your initial post of how it "quit pulling then started pulling again" along with the engine and driveshaft rpm mirroring each other, are you sure you don't need a couple clicks tighter on the rear shock compression? Maybe you have a little tire slip at the gear change?

__________________
'65 Tempest 467 3650# 11.30@120.31
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:12 PM.

 

About Us

The PY Online Forums is the largest online gathering of Pontiac enthusiasts anywhere in the world. Founded in 1991, it was also the first online forum for people to gather and talk about their Pontiacs. Since then, it has become the mecca of Pontiac technical data and knowledge that no other place can surpass.

 

Cold Case Radiators

Cold Case Radiators is a Max Performance company that produces high end aluminum performance radiators at a price point that won't break the bank. Polished and stamped tanks. 2 rows of 1" tubes. Lifetime Warranty.

GTOG8TA.com

GTOG8TA.com is a Max Performance company that manufacturers parts for the 04-06 GTO, 08-09 G8, and 93-02 Firebird/Trans Am platforms.

Copyright © 2017