[Steve C.]

And this regarding the Crower Camsaver lifters....

"I went with these Crower camsaver lifters because they are hydraulic flat tappet, and allow for pushrod oiling if you choose to use that feature. Each lifter has 2 opposing small flats on the outside which allows a small amount of oil to flow along the outside of the lifter housing. As the lifter rotates this oil sprays onto the cam lobe to give the cam direct oiling rather than the "splash only" oiling the engine came with from the factory."

Note on page 137 they have two different part numbers for the Pontiac Hyd flat tappet lifter. One with camsaver and one without.
And a note about camsaver at the bottom of the page:

https://www.crower.com/media/pdf/lifters.pdf


.

[Steve C.]

The CROWER Coolface option has the hole on the face of the lifter. It sends oil to the lifter face for reduced lobe wear. This option is on their solid flat tappet lifters.

Pages 139 & 140

https://www.crower.com/media/pdf/lifters.pdf

.

[Formulajones]

Ah so that's how they do it. Would be nice if they put that description with the lifter on their website.

[Jay S]

Just my opinion. But the Crower HFT cam shaver lifters are probably the best of the cheap HFT’s. I had a friend I picked a cam out for last week, and I suggested the Crower cam savers, which he ordered. Best of cheap was what I relayed to him, I guess that was what he was looking for.

Isky is probably the only other brand that is right in there for quality against HLJ. They are cheaper than HLJ, but more expensive than most lifters, and are a SBC core, which require different push rods.

It is really hard to tell how well the crown was machined looking at a photo. These days you can usually spot lifters made by HLJ by going off the price, they have gotten pretty expensive.

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Jay S

Just my opinion. But the Crower HFT cam shaver lifters are probably the best of the cheap HFT’s. I had a friend I picked a cam out for last week, and I suggested the Crower cam savers, which he ordered. Best of cheap was what I relayed to him, I guess that was what he was looking for.

Isky is probably the only other brand that is right in there for quality against HLJ.

Hi Jay, are you saying that Crower HFT lifters are made by Shaver?

Any thought on where Isky get theirs from?

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

I'm not seeing an oil hole, so I went to their website, still don't see anything and their description on their "cam saver" lifters are vague, as in they say nothing at all. So why are they called cam savers? I don't see anything different about them.

I used the Comp version that they called EDM at the time and they actually have a hole on the face of the lifter to squirt pressurized oil right onto the cam lobe.

I think Steve C covered this but just incase:

Crower has a hole machined in the bottom (face) of their SFT lifters for the additional oiling option. They mill a small flat on the side of the lifter body connecting the oil band to the bottom of the lifter for their HFT oiling option. If you look closely at 64speeds picture you can see the machined flat.

[P@blo]

Originally Posted by Steve C.

The CROWER Coolface option has the hole on the face of the lifter. It sends oil to the lifter face for reduced lobe wear. This option is on their solid flat tappet lifters.

Pages 139 & 140

https://www.crower.com/media/pdf/lifters.pdf

.

On a FT but Would a hole in the HFT be a good idea? I am no hydraulics expert but a grove in the outside lifter body is likely what is going on here. Takes about 2 minutes with some aluminum oxide sand paper if someone is ambitious.

Anyone able to test the hardness of any lifters compared to say, OE lifters? I have read ALL the new lifters are not has hard as they once were. Helps sell more parts I am sure...

[64speed]

They have a hole on them. It’s the light

[Steve C.]

"I’m not an expert by any stretch but I just received my Crower Cam Saver lifters and the machining looks great"

"They have a hole on them. It’s the light"

What Crower part number are these lifters ?
Based on current Crower on line product information a hole on the face suggests a solid flat tappet lifter.
And a "camsaver" designation suggests a hydraulic flat tappet lifter.

"The ones that Butler are sending are Hylift-Johnson and said they were the absolute best HFT left in production in their opinion."
This on 09-04-2022


.

[Jay S]

Originally Posted by PAUL K

Hi Jay, are you saying that Crower HFT lifters are made by Shaver?

Any thought on where Isky get theirs from?

Crower sells “Johnson” cam saver lifters for other brands (ford). They are advertise that way, and priced that way (expensive).

The Crowers are not Eaton/Delphi…and they look just like what Compcams sells, they are priced to compete with what comp sells..I think that kind of makes them Shaver’s doesn’t it? I can’t think of any other mfg they could be sourced from?


The Isky’s lifters used in Pontiacs are a SBC lifter that is called a “high band SBC” lifter. The only company I know of that made such a thing was Johnson Lifter’s in Taylor, MI..Not HLJ. Thought that was who made them at one time..and then Johnson quit making flat tappets. Now I have no idea…

[Jay S]

Here is an example of Crower’s “Johnson”cam saver lifters. Over $11 a lifter. Crower’s Pontiac offering is something different, priced cheaper. That is why I call the Pontiac cam savers the best of the cheaper HFT lifters.

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Jay S

Crower sells “Johnson” cam saver lifters for other brands (ford). They are advertise that way, and priced that way (expensive).

The Crowers are not Eaton/Delphi…and they look just like what Compcams sells, they are priced to compete with what comp sells..I think that kind of makes them Shaver’s doesn’t it? I can’t think of any other mfg they could be sourced from?


The Isky’s lifters used in Pontiacs are a SBC lifter that is called a “high band SBC” lifter. The only company I know of that made such a thing was Johnson Lifter’s in Taylor, MI..Not HLJ. Thought that was who made them at one time..and then Johnson quit making flat tappets. Now I have no idea…

IDK Jay, I'm so discouraged with the entire situation. Here's what I know for sure:

The folks making the most money off these lifters don't give one crap about the grief they are causing.

The engine builders that do the "right thing" are getting screwed on the deal, waisting a ton of time and loosing a bunch of sleep.

The customers are getting the shaft and most of them are just trying to enjoy a hobby.

As far as I know there are Hy-lift Johnson and imports. Thankfully as for now the imports look different than the Johnson's so it's easy to tell what you have the .

Hy-lift have their own issues and are priced way to high! My cost is close to $250 a set for the 951R's plus shipping and a drop ship fee, since I stopped stocking them.

The imports are a crap shoot. If they work. they are fine (atleast for a while) if they don't they fail in a big way. See my picture, these "import" lifters (repackaged by Crower, Erson, Lunati, Comp, Melling, and many others) were run on one of our USA made cam cores that was Nitrided, broke in properly without the inner springs and pre-lubed. The engine went about 30 miles, chewed up the bearings got abrasive crap throughout the engine, clogged the oil filter and ground off about .200 of material from the bottom of two lifter bodies (the other fourteen look great).

We feel our best option now are remanufactured GM lifters that we are modifying in house for performance applications. So far we have not had a single issue but only have about five engines in use with these lifters.

I ordered a set of Comp High Energy lifters and a set of their Pro Magnum. They were two different lifter bodies. The High Energy were imported ones most companies are selling. The Pro Magnums were a different lifter body I have never seen before. Don't know if they are any good but I'd certainly choose them over the High Energy.

Crower has purchased their flat tappet lifters (for a Pontiac) from Hy-lift for as long as I can remember. But when they were NA from Hy-lift they would buy them from another source and they would end up with an imported lifter. I'm guessing they are offering different price point lifters now to cover the huge increase in price for the Hy-lift parts.

It's a catch 22 for me. I hate to rag about the increased price for the Hy-lift product but when you pay a premium and still have failures it's a hard pill to swallow.

It's a real poop situation.

Of course all the above is JMHO

[Jay S]

Maybe you remember better than me Paul. I don’t think Crower ever listed lifters as being Johnson’s in the past. I think all the Crowers were Johnson’s, so there was no need for different pricing or advertising.

When the HLJ lifter took the big price hike, about the time frame when they switched to this other foundry, the price of the Crower Pontiac lifters didn’t follow the price hike. That got my attention that crowers offering changed.

Never has been a better time to buy a lifter surfacer!

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Jay S

Maybe you remember better than me Paul. I don’t think Crower ever listed lifters as being Johnson’s in the past. I think all the Crowers were Johnson’s, so there was no need for different pricing or advertising.

When the HLJ lifter took the big price hike, about the time frame when they switched to this other foundry, the price of the Crower Pontiac lifters didn’t follow the price hike. That got my attention that crowers offering changed.

Never has been a better time to buy a lifter surfacer!

Agree with all the above. Johnson would run dry at times and Crower would have to buy from a different source. The only thing I'm not sure of is when the big price increase came from Hy-lift. They used to be around $100 a set then they jumped to $160 and not long after to $250.... I haven't sold any in a while but I thought the $250 price was just before the Michigan foundry that made their lifter bodies closed.

Again, even at $250 a set it wouldn't be horrible if they were trouble free.

Remember when Crower offered their "money saving" cams and were reboxing the popular Camshaft Machine grinds? I get what Crower is doing, they're just trying to stay open. I wish them well they make great products... Their shipping department profits can only keep them afloat for so long.

[Jay S]

It makes you wonder how this is working out for Rhoads lifters. Made by HLJ, which is adding more $ to an already expensive lifter. Then on top of that they are continually 3 months out of stock!

[Tim Corcoran]

The Hy-Lift Johnson SFT liters come with or without an EDM hole depending on which one you order. I used to be a dealer and used to sell both types. Also I was an FAA inspector for many years and I am currently a delegated FAA inspector as an independent contractor and I can tell you that the FAA does not inspect production parts as alluded to in a previous post.

[KEN CROCIE]

#3: none of those companies mfg. lifters

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Tim Corcoran

The Hy-Lift Johnson SFT liters come with or without an EDM hole depending on which one you order. I used to be a dealer and used to sell both types. Also I was an FAA inspector for many years and I am currently a delegated FAA inspector as an independent contractor and I can tell you that the FAA does not inspect production parts as alluded to in a previous post.

Maybe you can share your thoughts on this. Johnson before it became Hy-lift used to check the hardness on every lifter it sold. Around 1990 they stopped this process, the same time the great lifter debacle of the twentieth century started. I could never wrap my head around why they stopped this. I thought if they performed the test for decades obviously they were rejecting lifters. If they weren't finding soft lifters why did the waiste effort checking every single lifter until that point.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Tim Corcoran

The Hy-Lift Johnson SFT liters come with or without an EDM hole depending on which one you order. I used to be a dealer and used to sell both types. Also I was an FAA inspector for many years and I am currently a delegated FAA inspector as an independent contractor and I can tell you that the FAA does not inspect production parts as alluded to in a previous post.

Yep I remember that, I bought a set from you years ago when I think you were living in Arizona at the time.

They are still going strong by the way

[P@blo]

Looks like the Melling JB-951 no longer is the hard capped style lifter. Last set came in looking the same as a Sealed Power HT-951 and are priced alike.

The JB951 also look like the ones Paul Spotts sells on ebay that say they are USA made. The lifters have the non-polished ground cam face listed in the Top Line catalog actually looking the same as theirs. Unknown body material though...