[nas t eh]

The Ford Lightning is a disaster, many of the EV cars are at least practical for everyday city driving or as a second vehicle.

[mzbk2l]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

The big 3 are loosing billions and the lots are full of ev's that are NOT selling.
This was before the strike.
People aren't completely stupid.

We're on a wait list for a Lyriq. They're selling faster than they can build them...

[nas t eh]

Originally Posted by mzbk2l

We're on a wait list for a Lyriq. They're selling faster than they can build them...

During covid some manufactures ( Toyota/Lexus to name one) figured out that selling less vehicles for more money was a better business plan and have controlled production or rather sales to certain regions to keep the profits up.

No idea if Cadillac got the message, but you will likely over pay to get that vehicle.

[KS circutguy]

Electrifying the car market may be getting more difficult, with the share of Americans who say they’re “very unlikely” to consider an EV for their next vehicle purchase growing in each of the first three months of the year, according to a new report.

In March, 21% of new-vehicle shoppers said they were “very unlikely” to consider an EV, up from 18.9% in February and 17.8% in January, consumer analytics firm JD Power said in a monthly EV report. In contrast, the percentage of car shoppers who say they are “very likely” to consider an EV was 26.9% in March, largely flat this year.

Persistent worries about charging infrastructure and vehicle pricing’s dampening enthusiasm, the report said. EV’s market share of all new-vehicle sales dropped to 7.3% in March, down from a record high of 8.5% in February but up from 2.6% in February 2020.

“Many new vehicle shoppers are becoming more adamant about their decision to not consider an EV for their next purchase,” JD Power said.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...g/70188358007/

US EV market struggles with price cuts and rising inventories.
Tesla sold 156,621 cars in Q3 and 493,513 cars in 2023 to date, both of which are more than for the same periods in 2022. However its market share has fallen from 62 percent to 50 percent as other brands begin to find their feet in terms of production. More importantly for the automaker, growing 26.3 percent year on year can only be seen as a big miss when the company repeatedly says it must grow at 50 percent year on year, something it also failed to do in 2022.
Cox says that it's seeing plenty of supply of new EVs, too, with 97 days of inventory compared to less than 60 days' supply for internal combustion engine cars at the start of September. For context, supply of both EV and gas-burners was around 52 days at the start of the year.

[mgarblik]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

The big 3 are loosing billions and the lots are full of ev's that are NOT selling.
This was before the strike.
People aren't completely stupid.

It is going to take considerable time for the manufacturers to figure out who the high volume buyers are and where the markets are and what vehicles will move the needle enough to convince the average new car buyer to plunk down the extra $$ an electric vehicle cost to get them off the lot.

The rude awakening right now seems to be they are running out of the "early adopter" customers. That group of people who will just run out and buy ANYTHING because it's new and different. Same people who will stand in line to pay $2000.00 for a phone. Once that market is saturated, selling overpriced, under performing vehicles becomes much more of a challenge.

At some point, probably sooner than later, these EV's will need to be serviced and maintained just like a gas car. My school was a Tesla training center. We were running classes for almost 2 years and had decent student count. In the last year as Tesla sales slowed and they had all kinds of other issues, one of the first programs to be pulled was the live, technical training classes. Program is gone now. All Training on-line. We now have a Rivian training class going but only 6 students. IMO it's going to take decades to finally sort all this product mix out and service for them.

[nas t eh]

I guess the advantage to buying from a large manufacturer that has been around for a while is they have a dealer service network for any issues that crop up.

[mgarblik]

Originally Posted by nas t eh

I guess the advantage to buying from a large manufacturer that has been around for a while is they have a dealer service network for any issues that crop up.

If I were considering buying an EV, which is loaded with unproven, complex electronics, sourced from all over the world, that would be a big concern for me. Many people just have no concern about service or reliability or product life cycle. A start-up like Rivian, Polestar, Fisker, Lucid, Faraday Future, XPeng, and a dozen others would scare the hell out of me.

[KS circutguy]

They can't even replace the old school Automotive "Tech - Mechanics" like me much less hire people who want to learn EV's.
Even though, if you have these skills you will always have work-job if you want to do it.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by mgarblik

It is going to take considerable time for the manufacturers to figure out who the high volume buyers are and where the markets are and what vehicles will move the needle enough to convince the average new car buyer to plunk down the extra $$ an electric vehicle cost to get them off the lot.

The rude awakening right now seems to be they are running out of the "early adopter" customers. That group of people who will just run out and buy ANYTHING because it's new and different. Same people who will stand in line to pay $2000.00 for a phone. Once that market is saturated, selling overpriced, under performing vehicles becomes much more of a challenge.

At some point, probably sooner than later, these EV's will need to be serviced and maintained just like a gas car. My school was a Tesla training center. We were running classes for almost 2 years and had decent student count. In the last year as Tesla sales slowed and they had all kinds of other issues, one of the first programs to be pulled was the live, technical training classes. Program is gone now. All Training on-line. We now have a Rivian training class going but only 6 students. IMO it's going to take decades to finally sort all this product mix out and service for them.

EVs, The answer to a question, that hardly anyone asks.

Good reading on why one of the Greenpeace founders says, nuclear energy, not windmills, and other gimmicky power production, is how the electric grid will be able to sustain EVs. Plus a whole lot of common sense about green initiatives, and how most people have it wrong.

https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...global+warming

When Musk tells us that 3 decades minimum, is how long it will take to make a wholesale changeover, why aren't people listening? The EV idea is way ahead of practical application in terms of years, engineering, and infrastructure. People aren't going to pay more money for something that isn't as good as their old transportation, and complicates their lives......

This guy say that EVs should be used to save fossil fuels, as it is a finite resource. We will need to rely on products from fossil fuels for the forseable future, and EVs can extend their usage. This makes much more sense to me as an application of EVs, than to say that we need to stop usage, and exploration of fossil fuels entirely. I believe this is the common sense approach, not the alarmists approach. This leaves the future open to antiques like myself that have grown up with ICE vehicles, not eliminate ICE vehicles, but use EVs to keep the ICE vehicles around for decades on a limited usage, kinda like what everyone on this board would like to see.

[KS circutguy]

We have oil for 300+ more years...

[nas t eh]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

We have oil for 300+ more years...

What are you doing, you can’t type that out loud for everyone to see?

[GTO JONES]

I just did a trip from Az to Ohio and back towing a 24 ft. enclosed trailer with my GTO in it. I stopped 9 times to fill with gas each way, only seen 1 charging station that had 12 chargers. No one was using them, just saying LOL.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by GTO JONES

I just did a trip from Az to Ohio and back towing a 24 ft. enclosed trailer with my GTO in it. I stopped 9 times to fill with gas each way, only seen 1 charging station that had 12 chargers. No one was using them, just saying LOL.

Charging stations aren't very often located at gas stations. They may be a mile off the Interstate, sitting next to a hotel or a Wal-Mart or some other spot. There were probably many of them along the way that you just didn't see.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

We have oil for 300+ more years...

I doubt anyone can say with certainty just how much oil is left in the ground but even if that is true, it's still a limited resource that will eventually run out. Kicking the can down the road for our ancestors to deal with it isn't a very good idea.

[455dan]

real world test of a model 3 Performance.

Israeli man says a Tesla saved his life.

Even with over 100 bullet holes and tires off some of the wheels, he was able to escape at speeds over 110 mph and make it to a hospital for his own wounds.

""They shot my tires, but the acceleration of the Tesla is amazing even in this situation, and the dual drive managed to keep me on the road. I quickly got away from them, but I realized that I had to get to the hospital as soon as possible and I drove at a speed of 112 mph with flat tires. The tires started to crumble, but the dual drive balanced out the wheels, some of which were already on the rims. According to the app, I continued to drive at around 110 mph," the Israeli man shared from hospital."

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com.../104439654.cms

[KS circutguy]

Originally Posted by Stuart

I doubt anyone can say with certainty just how much oil is left in the ground but even if that is true, it's still a limited resource that will eventually run out. Kicking the can down the road for our ancestors to deal with it isn't a very good idea.

Yes the Earth is constantly producing oil,the process never stopped Greta.lol

[KS circutguy]

Originally Posted by 455dan

real world test of a model 3 Performance.

Israeli man says a Tesla saved his life.

Even with over 100 bullet holes and tires off some of the wheels, he was able to escape at speeds over 110 mph and make it to a hospital for his own wounds.

""They shot my tires, but the acceleration of the Tesla is amazing even in this situation, and the dual drive managed to keep me on the road. I quickly got away from them, but I realized that I had to get to the hospital as soon as possible and I drove at a speed of 112 mph with flat tires. The tires started to crumble, but the dual drive balanced out the wheels, some of which were already on the rims. According to the app, I continued to drive at around 110 mph," the Israeli man shared from hospital."

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com.../104439654.cms

Now there's proof of the need to own one.
What a load of BS./

[nas t eh]

Originally Posted by 455dan

real world test of a model 3 Performance.

Israeli man says a Tesla saved his life.

Even with over 100 bullet holes and tires off some of the wheels, he was able to escape at speeds over 110 mph and make it to a hospital for his own wounds.

""They shot my tires, but the acceleration of the Tesla is amazing even in this situation, and the dual drive managed to keep me on the road. I quickly got away from them, but I realized that I had to get to the hospital as soon as possible and I drove at a speed of 112 mph with flat tires. The tires started to crumble, but the dual drive balanced out the wheels, some of which were already on the rims. According to the app, I continued to drive at around 110 mph," the Israeli man shared from hospital."

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com.../104439654.cms

I’m happy the guy got away,

Maybe we should all get airless tires or at least run flat tires in case we need them. Oh wait, my wife’s 335 has run flats and AWD.

Better idea, maybe the guy should have be in possession of a firearm, might have saved someone else besides himself? What if most people in Israel had permits to carry and used them?

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by Stuart

Charging stations aren't very often located at gas stations. They may be a mile off the Interstate, sitting next to a hotel or a Wal-Mart or some other spot. There were probably many of them along the way that you just didn't see.

Off I90 near Rochester within 1 mile there is one (1) charger at the Kwik Trip north of Stewartville and one (1) charger near airport north of the interstate. Neither of them are Tesla superchargers. The nearest 'fast' charger is 10 miles off the interstate.

The nearest one has a $2.00 connection charge and then $.28 per kwh.

That is not 'many' chargers considering Rochester is one of the larger communities in MN and this being a well traveled interstate.

What do you do if someone else is already plugged in or if that location is not functional? What if there is multiple people wanting to recharge ahead of you?

Bottom line, in the midwest, EV's are not a good viable option for people that travel longer distances.

If you use one for your daily commute to work - they serve a solid purpose - as you can recharge at home.

[Stuart]

The post I was responding to was about a ~2,000 mile trip from Arizona to Ohio, not an isolated area around Rochester. I looked at the Tesla trip planning website for a hypothetical trip from Tucson to Cincinnati, and it created the enclosed map showing the locations of their charging stations along the way. Look, I'm not trying to defend the EV industry, just stating the facts. I continue to drive my gasoline powered cars and don't have any plans to change.



I recently watched a video from the Aging Wheels YouTube channel where he showed the difficulty in making a road trip in his personal Polestar compared to a rented Tesla; he had no issues making the trip in the Tesla, while finding charging stations for his Polestar was problematic - many of them weren't charging at full capacity or were out of order. Conversely, he did another video several months ago where he and a friend did a road trip to a different destination in a Hyundai Ioniq 5, and that time they had no issues finding a charging station that was open and working at full capacity. It shows where you live and where you want to travel to can make a big difference. For some people an EV makes sense, for others it doesn't. it's as simple as that.