[Gach]

Originally Posted by 64speed

So my builder and I are friends so I asked him. He said he really didn’t care what I ran at this point as by now the engine is “broken in”. In the past he has had problems with ring seal with people immediately running exotic oil from day one. He stands behind his recommendation for Lucas or VR1 but any quality oil made for our cars is fine.

Exactly he’s going by his past experiences,

[Gach]

Come on guys we got a couple more pages to go to hit 10 the magic number..LOL i’ll tell you though I got a hell of an education from this. LOL come on guys you got to have a sense of humor and all this.

[Gach]

99.99% come here to ask questions and learn.

[Gach]

More facts…LOL

https://youtu.be/E2zS8MyvJxU?si=RtyJmW_gyIAFvY46

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by 78w72

Again, I agree, just saying what Ive read on more than one occasion over the years.

.

I understand where you're coming from, all good. Wasn't implying that towards you. Unfortunately people have posted some pretty stupid chit on the internet over the years that probably should have just stayed away from the keyboard.

Hopefully the op's engine lives a happy life no matter how he chooses to take care of it.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Gach

More facts…LOL

https://youtu.be/E2zS8MyvJxU?si=RtyJmW_gyIAFvY46

Ive posted the actual certified tested graphs on here quite a few times that also show cold pour properties and amsoil has some of the best ratings. Even their higher viscosity oils flow better than a lot of the lower viscosities from other brands.

So when someone tells you your oil is too thick for colder temps, just look up those graphs. Not all oils are created the same.

[steve25]

These days with the type of rings used and with the way rings are made if you had a shop do your build and they over bored the cylinders then the one and only reason there needs to be any ring break in period at all is because the shop left out the final important step .

This step should have been a brief Plateau hone session .

The term break in to me has always meant unnecessary ware and fine grit getting into the oil.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by PunchT37

I thought that also. For a long time. BUT, I added full synthetic Valvoline to my 5.3L Chevy truck. It had around 100,000 miles at that time. This thing, I bought new. I only, work on it. I got a deal on the oil. So, I used it. Truck only had regular oils since new.

Thing started leaking a short time later. I have changed the oil pan gasket and the valley gasket. It still has a small leak today at 150,000 miles. Prolly the cam sensor o ring.

Thing is, I used the same synthetic oil in my NEW built poncho 455. Even with rope seal. NO leaks.

So, maybe not a myth as I thought also. I`m 60 years old and have been a mechanic for 25 years, even though I`m out now. So, this is new to me and maybe not a myth.

I dont doubt synthetic can contribute to leaks by finding problems in gaskets/seals easier than normal oil... but the fact is that the oil itself didnt actually make the gasket go bad, it just found a compromised area that allowed the leak. at 100k miles that would be considered higher miles that could have old gaskets more prone to leaks or some dirt gunked up and synthetic oil cleaned it out allowing the leak.

Every situation can be different, for me, my 150k+ daily driver has zero leaks anywhere using full synthetic, usually valvoline... but as mentioned, modern foreign cars usually have engines designed to seal better than gm's or fords so that could be a factor. And your rebuilt pontiac doesnt leak with full synthetic so that indicates there was an issue with the 100k engine allowing the synthetic to leak.

FJ, I agree with the cold pour thing, amsoil is very good oil, but if you ever watched the project farm testing of oil cold pour, supertech synthetic does almost as good as the exotic amsoils, redline & royal purples in that test. The chart I recall you posting also compared the amsoil to other non synthetic oils, of course it cold pours better than even thinner normal oils. The other thing to remember, is that very few classic cars are started or driven in those cold pour test temps, so the actual hot weight of 50 in a 20/50 oil is still a 50 weight when hot and many "normal" street engines wont have any benefit from that super thick oil.

Its pretty normal for oil related threads to go off on other tangents once the main question is answered. Its not a "chit storm", lots of good info, & some bad gets posted for others to learn from. Personally I like discussing oil related subjects especially when there are so many myths or false info, like modern oil has had all the zddp removed, or you need a race type oil for a stock or small fully broken in cam or you cant switch from regular to synthetic oil for this or that reason. But looks like the OP builder was concerned about ring seat issues at break in vs leaks for the warranty.

[PunchT37]

Originally Posted by 78w72

I dont doubt synthetic can contribute to leaks by finding problems in gaskets/seals easier than normal oil... but the fact is that the oil itself didnt actually make the gasket go bad, it just found a compromised area that allowed the leak. at 100k miles that would be considered higher miles that could have old gaskets more prone to leaks or some dirt gunked up and synthetic oil cleaned it out allowing the leak.

Every situation can be different, for me, my 150k+ daily driver has zero leaks anywhere using full synthetic, usually valvoline... but as mentioned, modern foreign cars usually have engines designed to seal better than gm's or fords so that could be a factor. And your rebuilt pontiac doesnt leak with full synthetic so that indicates there was an issue with the 100k engine allowing the synthetic to leak.

I agree. That`s why I added the old school poncho to the discussion. The oil doesn`t "cause" a leak. But, I would use caution when adding to a higher mileage engine when that engine has had regular oil it`s whole life.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by 78w72

FJ, I agree with the cold pour thing, amsoil is very good oil, but if you ever watched the project farm testing of oil cold pour, supertech synthetic does almost as good as the exotic amsoils, redline & royal purples in that test. The chart I recall you posting also compared the amsoil to other non synthetic oils, of course it cold pours better than even thinner normal oils. The other thing to remember, is that very few classic cars are started or driven in those cold pour test temps, so the actual hot weight of 50 in a 20/50 oil is still a 50 weight when hot and many "normal" street engines wont have any benefit from that super thick oil.

.

I'd have to dig that graph out again, but it included both synthetics and non synthetics for a full comprehensive comparison that should help those that like their conventional oils, and maybe help shed a little light on why synthetics are better. When I stated even Amsoils cold pour temps were better than many thinner oils, that included many of the other lighter weight synthetics tested. As you could see demonstrated in Gach's post, even when compared to same weight synthetics such as Royal Purple which is highly regarded, it wasn't even remotely close to Amsoil. Amsoil's 20-50 even outperforms it in a cold pour test. So some synthetics are just better than others.
There are other good ones out there too, I'm not trying to promote Amsoil, just seems so many here choose to ignore industry standard and approved test facts and just want to keep regurgitating the same old rubbish that their dad's friends uncle was told from 30 years ago. Oil has come a long way since.

On another note, because I know people just don't want to spend money and that's where the subject will turn next based off every other oil discussion. Even though they are spending over $7 a quart for conventional VR1. I'm only paying $8 a quart for what people consider "exotic" Amsoil delivered to my door. So it's not like I'm spending a fortune for what I feel is way better protection based off my oil analysis. In fact it's actually saving me money because I've found I could extend those oil changes much further, up to 6,000 miles and still a very clean oil analysis.

When you consider it costs $10,000 or more to build a really nice solid 500-600+HP engine these days why would anyone be worried about oil that only costs them another $6-$7 per oil change? Doesn't anyone want the best for their investment? Instead people skate by with what ever seems to be working for the time being and on top of that don't even bother with an oil analysis to see how it's working for them. That's the part that doesn't make a whole bunch of sense to me. But hey, if it's working for everyone, so be it. We should get back to the subject after 100,000 miles and see how everyone is doing. Oh wait, no one drives these hot rod classic cars more than 1,000 miles a year so we'll all be dead and gone by then. lol

[Formulajones]

You know what would be interesting, this will probably go no where but it would be a great conversation and we wouldn't have to wait a century for mileage to accumulate, if a bunch of us pooled together, started and thread, and did an oil analysis, but not just any oil analysis. Posts with detailed engine specs, spring pressures, type of camshaft, which oil filter and air filter used, what brand of oil, driving habits throughout that span, and see how it's doing after 2000 or 3000 miles. Post the analysis and compare. Real results will be right on the paper.
Maybe we'll find out that some cheaper stuff might be working well or maybe the expensive stuff isn't doing any better, whether that be oils or filters. Might even find out if our oil filter of choice is worth anything. It would be a neat thread if we could get enough participants for a wide variety of oils and filters used. Post it for everyone to see and let those make what should be their own more educated decisions. At the very least others will find piece of mind with their choices while others may find problems they didn't know they had.
Just a thought.....

[jhein]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

You know what would be interesting, this will probably go no where but it would be a great conversation and we wouldn't have to wait a century for mileage to accumulate, if a bunch of us pooled together, started and thread, and did an oil analysis, but not just any oil analysis. Posts with detailed engine specs, spring pressures, type of camshaft, which oil filter and air filter used, what brand of oil, driving habits throughout that span, and see how it's doing after 2000 or 3000 miles. Post the analysis and compare. Real results will be right on the paper.
Maybe we'll find out that some cheaper stuff might be working well or maybe the expensive stuff isn't doing any better, whether that be oils or filters. Might even find out if our oil filter of choice is worth anything. It would be a neat thread if we could get enough participants for a wide variety of oils and filters used. Post it for everyone to see and let those make what should be their own more educated decisions. At the very least others will find piece of mind with their choices while others may find problems they didn't know they had.
Just a thought.....

I think that's a great idea. Coincidentally, as a result of these recent oil discussions here, I just ordered my oil sample collection kit a few days ago. Although I won't be sending it in until summer.