[GoreMaker]

Is this acceptable? Or should I go 0.005" shorter?

https://youtube.com/shorts/2NOA_MMesso?feature=share

[77 TRASHCAN]

My non expert observation says that will work!!!

[Dragncar]

You are good to go.

[25stevem]

Your fine with that as long as that is not the final time the chain goes on the gears!

Roller chains need to be soaked in a light oil if you do not want them to prematurely loosen up on you in the first 5 minutes of run time even at low rpms.

Just squirting oil on the chain as I have seen folks do from a trigger type oil can will not cut it .

You would be very surprised how long it takes for the hole in behind the cam retention plate to flow the needed oil into the timing cover, and even then when the motor is running its trying to throw the oil out of the chain.

[Elarson]

Originally Posted by 25stevem

Your fine with that as long as that is not the final time the chain goes on the gears!

Roller chains need to be soaked in a light oil if you do not want them to prematurely loosen up on you in the first 5 minutes of run time even at low rpms.

Just squirting oil on the chain as I have seen folks do from a trigger type oil can will not cut it .

You would be very surprised how long it takes for the hole in behind the cam retention plate to flow the needed oil into the timing cover, and even then when the motor is running its trying to throw the oil out of the chain.

Excellent advice. Chains don't stretch....they get loose by wearing at the hundreds of little contact points.

Eric

[25stevem]

Thanks, glad to be of some help!

I would like to add one more thing here concerning timing chains that I never hear talked about.
The way and amount of oil that gets fed to the timing cover at what the engineers consider normal passenger car rpms was with the use of a stock non roller timing chain.

Now a roller chain ( the chain itself) on the other hand has far more Surface area and calls more more oil to replenish what it throws out when spinning .

I feel most roller timing chains that die before there time in street motors that are not running crazy spring pressures is due to not getting enough oil volume and need the oil directed into the chain from a different angle then the way the factory location pumps it out .

Just my 2 cents on this, what do others have to say on this?

[Cliff R]

The slop will be double that after a couple hours of "run-in". Then it will "set" and be OK for quite a while.

I used a Rollmaster once, and it did fine for about 4 years. I even had the front cover off to move the cam 4 times doing some ICL testing and it had some slop in it but nothing alarming.

About a year after the last visual insection I was racing the car at Dragway 42 and it really started to slow down. I lost 3-4 MPH and a couple of tenths in ET. It was also breaking up some on top end. Never once did I suspect the Rollmaster timing set was loose and flopping around, but that turned out to be the problem when i pulled the engine for inspection and "freshening up".......

[GoreMaker]

Originally Posted by 25stevem

Your fine with that as long as that is not the final time the chain goes on the gears!

Nope, that's just the initial test-fit to determine if I should exchange it for a shorter one. Cam isn't even secured in the block yet, it's just floating there

[GoreMaker]

Originally Posted by 25stevem

I feel most roller timing chains that die before there time in street motors that are not running crazy spring pressures is due to not getting enough oil volume and need the oil directed into the chain from a different angle then the way the factory location pumps it out .

Just my 2 cents on this, what do others have to say on this?

What I've done in the past on the advice of a previous machinist is clean the chain thoroughly with solvent and then soak it in a bath of ATF for at least 30 minutes before final install. That seems to do wonders during initial break-in, and then the amount of oil that gets fed in there becomes sufficient to maintain a proper film. Since this is going on a 557-casting block, it's only intended as a street engine

[GoreMaker]

It's entirely possible that there will be less slop when I use the correct matching crank gear. In the video above, I'm test-fitting the Rollmaster with a crank sprocket from whatever timing chain set Butler provides with their cam kits because I can't get the Rollmaster crank sprocket to fit on the snout AT ALL. The BP crank sprocket fits fine, it slides right on with a perfect fit, but the Rollmaster is insanely tight. The cam sprocket fits fine, though.

[25stevem]

Is it tight in the keyway groove, or on the crank snout?

Make sure the lip on the crank gear facing the block has a nice lead in chamfer.

[GoreMaker]

It won't even slip over the front edge of the snout. It seems to be like 0.005" smaller in ID than the BP sprocket, though I only have sprung telescoping gauges and outside micrometers to confirm that. The ID is even from front to back, there's no obvious taper or chamfer.

I bet I could heat up the sprocket to make it fit, but then I'd need a puller to get it off again and that would make setting the timing on the cam a real bear.

[rwfisher]

Originally Posted by GoreMaker

It won't even slip over the front edge of the snout. It seems to be like 0.005" smaller in ID than the BP sprocket, though I only have sprung telescoping gauges and outside micrometers to confirm that. The ID is even from front to back, there's no obvious taper or chamfer.

I bet I could heat up the sprocket to make it fit, but then I'd need a puller to get it off again and that would make setting the timing on the cam a real bear.

Ok, time to start the conversation over. Chain slack really needs to be checked with the gears that go with the chain your going to be using. Need to address why the crank sprocket doesn’t fit before you go further. Guessing the bore of the gear is dimensioned for press on use and not slip on.

[GoreMaker]

I checked with my machinist. The Rollmaster sprocket is "0.001 smaller in ID than the BP (looks like a Cloyes). Also, my Eagle crank snout is like" 0.002 bigger than every Pontiac snout I've measured. So it looks like the tolerance variance is just stacking against me in this case. I'm gonna do my cam timing with the Cloyes crank sprocket, then do the final install with the Rollmaster.

Honestly, I don't think it matters which crank sprocket I use. The chain pin pitch is the same on both sets. There are only 2 different pitches I've ever come across over the years, and they're pretty distinctly different from each other. But I still prefer to use the sprocket that came with the chain.

I used the Cloyes timing set from BP to determine if a standard length would work, since I already had it on hand. Then I ordered a BOP Rollmaster set with thrust bearing in standard length. Didn't expect the Rollmaster crank sprocket to not slip-fit...