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#1
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Newbie looking for info on 1964 Catalina
All--
First post, I'm in the process of buying a 1964 Catalina convertible, but I'm having a heck of time trying get info on the Catalina mechanical specifics. I helped a friend rebuild his 1964 Impala convertible, (rebuilt engine, 700R4, new rear-end, paint, SS brakes), but from what I can gather, the Cat is a much different animal. I've done the normal web searches and can't seem to find info on the mechanicals like frame design, suspension parts, etc. Any pointers would be appreciated. Thanks, Ron Portland, OR |
#2
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Some parts from an Impala are interchangeable with the Catalina, but not much - cosmetic only tho. Mechanically, the Impala and Catalina are two different beasts.
Your best bet is to locate a service manual for the Catalina (1963 with 1964 supplement) and start there. First, before you buy the car, make sure it's complete especially the side trim moldings (and make sure they are useable) as those are extremely hard to find and very costly if you do find a set (like $1500 for a decent set of the 6 pieces) Check the rear trunk body mounts (PY has them) and frame rot under the doors is the first thing you need to check. This is the right place to post your questions for you '64 Catalina - best forum for Pontiacs on the web. It would likely be a 389cid engine, 2bbl carb, with the roto-hydromatic transmission (a.k.a. "slim jim"), which is a POS - but can easily be replaced by a TH400. Performance Years has a great list of reproduction parts for the car, but some you will have to acquire via "good used" (www.indianapontiacs.com) Ron
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Never trust anything that bleeds for five days and won't die. |
#3
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Ron--
Thanks for the pointers! I'll check out the points you mentioned when looking at the car. As I continue to search the web, it becoming really clear that I have a lot to learn about Pontiacs. Now I need figure out what a 'slim jim' is... I appreciate the help and hopefully will be Cat owner in a week. Thanks, Ron Portland, OR |
#4
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it is a transmission without a torque converter. that is all I know. Stevep is our resident tranny guy.
www.rareparts.com will have all your suspension parts. You can get them at Carquest as well. Warning they are expensive but peace of mind is well worth the price. Now all you need to do is post some pictures. patrick
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#5
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Patrick--
Thanks for the addition parts source... now I just need to work on balancing the price to title ratio. I'm now reading up on the 389... Stay tuned. ;^) Thanks, Ron |
#6
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Firstly,
Welcome to the Darkside as we say.. fans of the B bodies call ourselves DARKSIDERS.. as in once you go to the dark side etc.. Secondly, we have to see pics as soon as you have some. Thirdly, as a fellow owner of a 64.. be ready for a little frustration.. only because it seems that 64 was a big transition year in certain respects. Pontiac made some changes in the 64 model year that can make some parts less common meaning its a little bigger PITA to find. Pontiac made changes to starter mounts between 63 and 64 so you have to look at where the starter mounts. 61-64 the starters are not mounted to the engine block. 65 and later they are mounted to the block. From what Ive read most 64 blocks are setup for block mounted starters (mine is) but Im not sure ALL blocks are. Also, Pontiac changed the intake/head setup between 64 and 65.. meaning 61-64 intakes and heads and 65-later intakes and heads are not interchangeable. There are threads that show the differences. The result is that there is a lot of add ons for 65-later heads/intakes but 61-64 there is not a lot. All in all, I love my 64 but sometimes things are a little harder to find and/or unavailable. Body panels and some trim parts (as prev mentioned) can be a real PITA to find. Welcome to the world of B bodies. My Bonneville does not have the slim jim trans so I cant tell you about that. The shorter wheelbase models came with a slimjim auto in that year but the longer wheelbase models like my Bonneville came with a diff automatic trans. There are threads that document a change to a TH400 for the shorter wheelbase models but I believe some minor tunnel mods are required for the change. There are a lot of folks here who can help you with whatever you need. Good luck and good hunting. John
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Not all who wander are lost... 1964 Starchief 4 Dr Sedan - 389 4Bbl - Auto - Pinehurst Green/ Gold cloth 1964 Grand Prix - 389 4 BBl w SupHyd auto 1964 Catalina Safari - 63 389 200r4 auto.. 2.69 POSI rear 1964 Bonneville Vert - 389 4bbl - Auto - Ext Color - Saddle/Saddle int 1965 2+2 - WG 421 4Bbl - 4 spd - Bluemist Slate w White/black int 1966 Ventura 4 dr Sdn - 389 4Bbl - Auto -Orig Color - Barrier Blue |
#7
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The transmission in a 61-64 Catalina is the Roto Hydramatic 375 AKA Slim-Jim.
The Bonneville and Star Chief got the Dual Coupling Hydra Matic, which was far better. This will help you to understand a little about it. BTW, it looked GREAT on paper! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_Roto...c_transmission
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The difference between inlaws and outlaws? Outlaws are wanted |
#8
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All--
Thanks for the guidance and help. I think I can handle the "uniqueness" since i also own a 76 International Scout and 1995 Range Rover LWB. Weird models seems to be in my blood... the number of time when I'm trying to fix something an looking for a part the subtle manta of "... if I only had bought a Jeep", starts to cross one's mind. OK... I bought it and pick it up on the 10th. Let the adventure begin. Thanks, Ron Last edited by ronstory; 06-30-2013 at 10:26 PM. Reason: spelling |
#9
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Congrats on your purchase, Ron! Let's see some pics!
I purchased a '64 Grand Prix, which sat in a dirt lot for 15+ years, about two years ago. My car is a work in progress and will be for a while. I'm on this forum all the time. As others have said in this thread, you have come to the right place to find info about your car. The members in this forum and their knowledge is invaluable. You name the topic or the question, and there's probably a thread for it in this forum. Use the search button at the top of this forum on the topic you are inquiring about, and if you can't find what you are looking for, ask away. Good luck! Chris |
#10
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All--
Here you go... Ron |
#11
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Quote:
You'll enjoy your Pontiac once you get to put some miles on it. That's what these cars are all about Welcome to the forums.
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so many pontiacs, so little time.................. moderator is a glorified word for an unappreciated prick.................. "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." --Albert Einstein "There is no such thing as a good tax." "We contend that for a nation to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle." - Winston Churchill |
#12
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Welcome aboard!!
Your droptop represents the DarkSide very nicely! |
#13
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Thanks! I just ordered the 1964 Pontiac service manuals from ebay... so I've got some reading to do.
Apparently there is a some seeping occasionally at the radiator and it's missing the fan shroud plus there oil leak on the front of the engine. BTW, anything is better than fighting a rear main leak on an IH V8. That is one of my many definitions of "inconveniently located". Also, while I'm in there I'll like drop a Aluminum radiator and since the shroud is missing anyways I'll probably install an electric fan and a SPAL controller... been happy with the combo on several vehicles. Are all early water pumps (1964) 11 bolts water pumps created equal? I normally look for a 'high-flow' version, but can seem to find anything for the early 389. Thanks, Ron '64 Cat Convertible (soon - July 10th) Last edited by ronstory; 07-02-2013 at 01:01 AM. Reason: spelling |
#14
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64 should be an 8 bolt pump, it it still has the timing cover it was born with.
if you have to pull the harmonic balancer, it's a slip fit on a Pontiac so the bolt is tight (160 ft lbs iicr)
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65 Bonneville Brougham 4DHT 65 Grand Prix 2DHT......now parts 65 Catalina 2+2 2DHT 65 Catalina Safari 4DSW |
#15
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(sigh) Yes, you are correct... I looked at the engine photo from 3 angles and there only 5 bolts visible on the top half. So I have a 8 bolt, but most of the pages (like Butler Perf) seem to refer anything performance as something like "8-Bolt 1965-68 Pontiac Hi Volume Cast Iron Water Pump". Will a 1965 work or is there some other change?
Thanks for the warning on the harmonic balancer. I need to get in there to check since I may not have a roller timing chain. Unless the dark-side is immune to need such technology. Boy, do I have a lot to learn.... Thanks, Ron '64 Cat Convertible (soon - July 10th) |
#16
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63 1/2 to 65 was the same water pump, p/n changed in 66 but I am pretty sure they are the same also.
required reading about the water pumps...and divider plates. http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=411256
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65 Bonneville Brougham 4DHT 65 Grand Prix 2DHT......now parts 65 Catalina 2+2 2DHT 65 Catalina Safari 4DSW |
#17
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Really nice car
Welcome, nice car ya got there, probably Marimba Red for 1964. The data plate, located on the firewall will provide the factory color code, as well as other info.
The engine code is located below the head mating surface on the passenger, front side. It is a two digit number combined with a letter. Something like 26K, this will help ID the factory specs. Fan shrouds only came on AC cars, they're stamped steel and you can certainly install one when you find one. Welcome again, Greg |
#18
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OK... I'm not smarter on darkside water pumps. I'll start a new thread on the adventure that begins early July 10th with a flight to pick up the Cat 300 miles away. I'll also be looking for opinions & suggestions for improvements needed for it fit into the garage with the rest of it's roommates.
The roommates have three categories, comfort, cool, crazy. The cat will slide into the 'cool' category. Thanks, Ron |
#19
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I was not expecting to see a car that nice. That's a beauty! By the way, happened to notice this in the classifieds...Not sure if it's applicable- http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=731551
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Greg Reid Palmetto, Georgia Last edited by Greg Reid; 07-04-2013 at 01:58 PM. |
#20
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Ahh... if only I was closer. I would want to take a look at the AC unit. ;^)
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