[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by turbo69bird

Smokey was so bad ass . He’d take a car cut it all up rake back the windshield etc. Then he’d take a factory car do the same and put it out in the parking lot at the track . If he got questioned on it he’d say “ look there’s a dead stock one out there go measure it. “. So smart and crafty .

Yes, he was. His ‘66 NASCAR Chevelle was a tribute on bending the rule book but NOT breaking a single rule. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when he drove it out of the NASCAR inspection garage…with the fuel tank missing!

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by tom s

SCAT shows a 3in main 4in stroke with BBC rods.Tom

Tom, I have seen a couple of online complaints about Scat’s quality control of late. Seems that they can’t manage to grind two journals the same size.

[Formulajones]

I've never expected any of that stuff to be spot on anyway and always have this stuff checked over.

Can't tell you how many times balanced assemblies still need balanced, or how many sets of brand new rods still had to be resized on the big end and the small ends needed honed for proper pin clearance.

It's just the nature of these things anymore it seems. Been that way with Eagle stuff too as far back as 30 years ago that I can remember.

[Formulajones]

To take that a step further, even factory OEM cranks I've found to not be perfect.

Many of them aren't even at their factory advertised stroke and come up a pinch short. Most times that can be corrected when reground.

[tom s]

Anyone that buys a import crank HAS to have them checked!I have been lucky with my SCAT cranks.The last import crank I used was a 3in 3 3/4 forged in my 383 301 stroker engine.Went to MARINE Crankshaft to have the thrust welded and nitrited.Went to Castio to be cut to BBC Js.I think that was a OHIO,I have used a few OHIOs and SCATs,never had to cut the mains.Tom

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

To take that a step further, even factory OEM cranks I've found to not be perfect.

Many of them aren't even at their factory advertised stroke and come up a pinch short. Most times that can be corrected when reground.

A lot of factory stuff isn’t even close to being on stroke. I can’t tell you how many HiPo BBC cranks I have ground .020 under because they were so far out of stroke that .010 under was impossible. That is to be expected from OE stuff. What galls me is having to grind a brand new crank .020 under because of piss poor quality control from alleged “performance oriented” companies.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by tom s

Anyone that buys a import crank HAS to have them checked!I have been lucky with my SCAT cranks.The last import crank I used was a 3in 3 3/4 forged in my 383 301 stroker engine.Went to MARINE Crankshaft to have the thrust welded and nitrited.Went to Castio to be cut to BBC Js.I think that was a OHIO,I have used a few OHIOs and SCATs,never had to cut the mains.Tom

Agreed, Tom. I check EVERY crank I use, whether it’s a Chinese crank or not. The worst cranks I have seen about being out of spec were Cummins 6B forgings from Mexico. The best? IDI 6.9/7.3 forgings. They were seldom more than .005-.007 out of stroke.

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Yes, he was. His ‘66 NASCAR Chevelle was a tribute on bending the rule book but NOT breaking a single rule. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when he drove it out of the NASCAR inspection garage…with the fuel tank missing!

That "Fire Hose" fuel line made it possible and he really did not have far to drive.

Tom V.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

A lot of factory stuff isn’t even close to being on stroke. I can’t tell you how many HiPo BBC cranks I have ground .020 under because they were so far out of stroke that .010 under was impossible. That is to be expected from OE stuff. What galls me is having to grind a brand new crank .020 under because of piss poor quality control from alleged “performance oriented” companies.

Yeah that's frustrating for sure. I've just come to expect it anymore and not surprised by it.

[bob prichard]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

455 block, 428 crank, done. Properly done you will never, ever hurt them in a street engine.
Or you can pay big bucks to Modex, Bryant or Crower and get exactly zero benefit in a street engine except a lightened bank account.

I paid Crower to make me a billet crank and send it to Jim Butler seven years ago for my 461 build when Chinese cranks were flying off the shelf. I couldn’t stand the thought of a Chinese crank going in my GTO. That is my bucket list motor that I am so proud of. When you say nothing but a lightened bank account you are not counting for pride of ownership. That was one of the best wallet lightenings I have ever had. God bless Jim Butler, Crower, and Pontiac.

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

I've never expected any of that stuff to be spot on anyway and always have this stuff checked over.

Can't tell you how many times balanced assemblies still need balanced, or how many sets of brand new rods still had to be resized on the big end and the small ends needed honed for proper pin clearance.

It's just the nature of these things anymore it seems. Been that way with Eagle stuff too as far back as 30 years ago that I can remember.

Every set of offshore rods I have ever bought the big ends were tight.
Until I bought Molnars, dead on.

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by bob prichard

I paid Crower to make me a billet crank and send it to Jim Butler seven years ago for my 461 build when Chinese cranks were flying off the shelf. I couldn’t stand the thought of a Chinese crank going in my GTO. That is my bucket list motor that I am so proud of. When you say nothing but a lightened bank account you are not counting for pride of ownership. That was one of the best wallet lightenings I have ever had. God bless Jim Butler, Crower, and Pontiac.

That is a good point. Hopefully you got a Crower crank made from a USA billet and not an import. Years ago I needed a wrist pin to save a set of original SD-455 rods being used in a Super Duty rebuild. I talked with Jim Butler to see if they might be able to scrounge up a single wrist pin for us. He suggested we could always install a set of Eagle rods in the Super Duty engine. I told him I thought it would be sacrilegious to install a set of Chinese rods in a Super Duty engine.

I'm currently building two engines for a guy that feels the same way. He pony'd up extra dollars to use Crower rods in his 455 topped with SD heads and a Bathtub intake manifold. We are using SD rods in his original 421 rebuilt that's being topped off with 980 heads and a tri-power.

[Tom Vaught]

I believe in the old Jim Butler Days, Bruce Crower and his brother were still using USA
steel to build their Connecting Rods. As you said, the Eagles were some of the first
Chinese Rods. But at the time, the Eagle QC was pretty good for the Chinese stuff.

Mr Molnar used to be the Chief Engineer for Oliver Rods before he started his own company.

Tom V.

I personally have always used the Carrillo Rods. Maybe overkill for the HP level but I was hard on engines.

[bob prichard]

Originally Posted by PAUL K

That is a good point. Hopefully you got a Crower crank made from a USA billet and not an import. Years ago I needed a wrist pin to save a set of original SD-455 rods being used in a Super Duty rebuild. I talked with Jim Butler to see if they might be able to scrounge up a single wrist pin for us. He suggested we could always install a set of Eagle rods in the Super Duty engine. I told him I thought it would be sacrilegious to install a set of Chinese rods in a Super Duty engine.

I'm currently building two engines for a guy that feels the same way. He pony'd up extra dollars to use Crower rods in his 455 topped with SD heads and a Bathtub intake manifold. We are using SD rods in his original 421 rebuilt that's being topped off with 980 heads and a tri-power.

Thank you for your response. I don’t know where the crank material came from, I just assumed it was made here. I also used their rods. My wife and I feel very strongly about using made in America parts, and always do willingly when possible, even though it costs more.

[sdbob]

I have 16 NOS SD rods. I bought when nothing else available. Jim told me sell them. I've just kept them. What do I know! They are special because they are Pontiac, engineers design and mfg.

[tom s]

980s and a TRIPOWER?For shame!Tom

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by tom s

980s and a TRIPOWER?For shame!Tom

Well first you have to figure out how to support 750 horsepower with a tri-power and then you'll realize they aren't that bad.

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by sdbob

I have 16 NOS SD rods. I bought when nothing else available. Jim told me sell them. I've just kept them. What do I know! They are special because they are Pontiac, engineers design and mfg.

I'd use them! Vendors need to push the products they sell. Super Duty rods were very good rods back in the day. Nothing has changed they are still good rods.

[1157 motor head]

Originally Posted by mgarblik

As b-man said, Billet is the only true American choice and you would need to verify where the billet came from if that's important to you. Crower current lead time is about 6 months and approaching 4K now with all the price increases. A more budget friendly, sort of USA made and with good quality control may be a Molnar Crankshaft. The machining is done in the USA, and their quality control is excellent from my limited experience so far. Other Chinese cranks say the machining is done in the USA as well but that doesn't guarantee quality. Eagle, Scat and some others make those claims. No matter what, you as the customer will need to check it yourself or have a trusted machine shop verify ALL the dimensions when you get it. Good luck.

OH how true, my builder finds these " ready to use" crank journals tapered , due to poorly prepared grinding wheels and out of spec. , all the time.

[Sirrotica]

I also have a set of 8 NOS, SD rods that have been tested to be sure they didn't come out of one of the substandard batches that didn't get proper heat treatments. Mine passed with flying colors, but the oval track engine they were slated to go in got waylaid by life, about 1982. Damn 40 years ago.....

Maybe some day I'll assemble it and run it on the street, I still have all the parts hanging around, along with dished pistons ands some heavily worked RA IV heads that are sitting since they were ported in the early 80s. Everything was balanced, and it just needs to be fitted and assembled.

The crank was cut and it's just a cast Pontiac crankshaft, but way back then that was about all we had to choose from. No way I could ever buy a billet crank back then.

My 428 in the 69 GP stock car in my signature pictures ran for 3 years with a cast crank, and cast reconditioned rods, and the old heavy TRW forged pistons hanging on them.

I still have that running engine that I pulled out in 1981 sitting in storage. It would need a rebuild, but it held up to 3 years on an oval track, with weekly use. The old cast cranks are pretty tough when all the clearances are right, they seem to last under hard usage pretty well. Spun rod bearings is what trashed thousands of Pontiac engines back then.