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Old 11-17-2020, 05:58 PM
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Default Ram Air IV Service Replacement Block

I am trying to determine the value of my 1970 400 RA IV SR block . #9799915, A072 casting date. It is .030 over with round bores, no rust and was running when removed from my TA.
Thanks!

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Old 11-18-2020, 06:58 AM
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I don't think there's any way to nail down how much someone would pay who has a on going restoration of a IV car and needs a block.

The reply's you get will likely be like opinions and A holes!

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Old 11-18-2020, 08:17 AM
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As stated, if you find someone who needs it today for their restoration it could command a higher price but timing is everything. Your best bet is decide what you need to get out of it and price it accordingly and see if it sells. Other option is to toss on EBAY with a ridiculous reserve and see what it gets bid up to.. God knows there are a ton of people doing exactly that. I would opt for the first just because I feel it is better for the hobby. Just by listing your question I'm sure you will be getting inquires offers from members anyway.

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Old 11-18-2020, 01:17 PM
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As others have said, it's most valuable to someone restoring a '70 Ram Air IV car. That value is depending upon how desperate the vehicle owner is and how much they're willing to pay. It should have good value though.

I have been collecting info from service replacement blocks for quite some time so if you have pics, I'd love to add the SR8 number, the cast date, the casting number, and 4-bolt caps to my electronic collection!

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Old 11-18-2020, 02:51 PM
Joe's Garage Joe's Garage is offline
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Default We've sold several RAIV SR blocks in the past few years.

They have extra value because so many of the original RAIV blocks were lost when these cars were newer and those stupid cast connecting rods exited the block while the owner's were having some fun. It's kind of sad that Pontiac didn't have the SD455 style rod in full production a couple of years earlier..... Then a lot more of the RAIV cars would have original blocks in them.

Does your block have the actual 'as-cast' 9799915 casting number or are one or more of the numbers ground off and stamped? With the 1972 casting date, I'd presume the whole number is ground and stamped.

A 9799915 block that has an 'as-cast' casting number should bring fairly huge money. $5k plus to the right person.

We sold another SR block with the 979991_5_ casting where just the last digit was ground off and restamped less than a year ago. +.030, round bores, good, straight main bore, early 1970 casting date. $4500.

Sold another about two years ago where the entire 9799915 casting number was ground off and restamped. +.060 with one sleeve. I think that casting date was in late 1971. $3700.

And, finally, just for reference, sold a 9792506 1969 Ram Air IV SR block with the '2506' ground and stamped. +.030 but had a couple of bores that needed to be honed due to taper. early 1970 casting date. $4000.

Good luck with yours!

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Old 11-18-2020, 07:06 PM
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Default RA IV SR Pictures

Here are two of the pictures Rocky asked for.
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Old 11-18-2020, 07:47 PM
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Thanks!

If the number is completely stamped, which it is here (and I suspected it was by the cast date) then it was originally a typical 481988 400 block that was machined to accept 4-bolt caps and stamped 9799915 for the SR applications for the parts department.

For the record, an original 9799915 block wasn’t constructed any differently than the typical 9799914. The only difference was 4 bolt main caps.

Can you tell if there are any cast numbers on the main caps on your SR block?

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Old 11-19-2020, 12:35 AM
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First of all, are we sure it has the 4 bolt caps? That’s the biggest question in my mind. SR blocks are the easiest to fake. Real simple to grind the original casting number down on a 72 SR block and claim it’s a IV OR III replacement.

9799914 and 9799915 blocks used the same main caps. They also used unique hardware. I’d wanna see the bolts AND the casting number on the FRONT cap as people all the time swap the 4 bolt caps out but few know that the front is also different. If and ONLY IF all that is correct for a ram air block then maybe the value is there. Most IV owners will rather have a correctly coded original block for their car over a SR block. Because SR blocks are so easily faked many tend to shy away from em for that very reason. It’s kind of a last option. What are they gonna do, claim their original block was destroyed and replaced under warranty? If so they might as well restamp a block and claim its original. A BS story is a BS story. In my opinion if the block is probably 1500-2k. Standard bore 4 bolt blocks should bring 2k to someone wanting to build a high HP motor. It’ll cost ya 1k plus to buy Program 4 bolt mains and have em installed on a 2 bolt block. Just my opinion.

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Old 11-19-2020, 12:36 AM
FASTASSBIRD FASTASSBIRD is offline
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I need to qualify when I said 14 and 15 blocks used the same main caps I meant 4 bolt ram air blocks. Obviously 2 bolt blocks used different caps entirely. Sorry Rocky didn’t mean to step on your toes

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Old 11-19-2020, 05:16 AM
Joe's Garage Joe's Garage is offline
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Default Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

Maybe in some corner of the universe a collector would rather shell out big bucks for a 'WW' block with the wrong serial number on it, but we haven't run into many that think that way.

Instead, we've found (over the past 40 years in Pontiac-land), that the most acceptable replacement for a missing original engine block is a verifiable Service Replacement block.

I've never had anyone question a Service Replacement block further than "Why is there a SR block?"

The explanation is direct and simple:
1) The engine got killed.
2) The car got a new SR block.
3) Life went on.

That's probably why a SR block will command just about the same money as a real RAIV block that is not correct for the car.

That's our experience, but we've only sold around two dozen different SR blocks for various applications over the years with ZERO issues.

389, std 400 RAI, RAII, RAIII, RAIV, 455, 455HO & SD455.

I might have to take the time to make a list......

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Old 11-19-2020, 02:56 PM
FASTASSBIRD FASTASSBIRD is offline
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I can’t think of many high end ram air cars with SR blocks off the top of my head but I can think of many with properly coded correct application blocks such as WW WS WQ YW YZ etc. This is all a matter of opinion and somewhere on this site there is a LENGTHY thread on this subject. If you’re searching for a SR block NOW, it’s gonna be kinda hard to make the claim it was replaced under warranty 45-50 years ago. One might find themselves in a world of CHIT if one makes that claim and the original block surfaces. This has happened before. My experience over the last 20-25 years, almost everyone I’ve dealt with wants the correct letter coded block over a SR block. Plus as stated before, it’s REAL easy to find a 72 SR block, purchase it have a machine shop line bore it for original 4 bolt main caps (usually just the center caps) then grind it down and stamp a Ram Air Block number, be it II, III or IV.

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Old 11-19-2020, 03:04 PM
FASTASSBIRD FASTASSBIRD is offline
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Here is one thread that deals with SR vs Correct


http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...28#post5762828

  #13  
Old 11-19-2020, 03:11 PM
FASTASSBIRD FASTASSBIRD is offline
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And another with some VERY thorough and thoughtful responses from guys who own or deal in ram air stuff.


http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...29#post5766029

  #14  
Old 11-20-2020, 04:57 PM
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Default RA IV SR Pictures

Here are the block and main cap pictures. #1 cap cast GM 8786621. #3 cap cast
GM 8786623. #5 cap cast GM 8786625 or 8786626. The 8's may be 9's. Hard to tell! No visible casting numbers on caps 2 and 4. Thanks to everyone for their input. Gary
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Old 11-20-2020, 06:44 PM
FASTASSBIRD FASTASSBIRD is offline
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That’s a legit 4 bolt front main cap and those are the correct legit bolts for a 4 bolt block so I’d say chances are it was a SR block

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Old 11-20-2020, 07:01 PM
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Gary,

Thanks for sharing the detailed photos.

I concur, there's nothing about your block would suggest that it's anything other than an authentic SR application for a 1970 R/A IV.

  #17  
Old 11-22-2020, 04:37 PM
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Default RA IV SR Pictures

Here is the date code
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Old 11-22-2020, 07:22 PM
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Thank you!

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Old 01-13-2021, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Garage View Post
Maybe in some corner of the universe a collector would rather shell out big bucks for a 'WW' block with the wrong serial number on it, but we haven't run into many that think that way.

Instead, we've found (over the past 40 years in Pontiac-land), that the most acceptable replacement for a missing original engine block is a verifiable Service Replacement block.

I've never had anyone question a Service Replacement block further than "Why is there a SR block?"

The explanation is direct and simple:
1) The engine got killed.
2) The car got a new SR block.
3) Life went on.

That's probably why a SR block will command just about the same money as a real RAIV block that is not correct for the car.

That's our experience, but we've only sold around two dozen different SR blocks for various applications over the years with ZERO issues.

389, std 400 RAI, RAII, RAIII, RAIV, 455, 455HO & SD455.

I might have to take the time to make a list......

I can say with certainty sometimes a SR block did end up in these cars. These short blocks didn’t last long as race engines.

If you had a car like mine that had the dealer swap in a RAII block that was already balanced and blueprinted for the race season, then drop in a SR block at the end of a season what would you put in the car? A WH block that never saw any time in the car at all since day 1 ?

Let me clarify( stephens RAII short block survived because they didn’t use the stock rods but the mystery rod found in Mc carthys book) I only know this because I still have the rods. Regular guys didn’t have those upgrades for an option. Stephens had whatever they needed.

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Old 01-13-2021, 08:41 PM
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I have a engineering std deck 303 block.No EUN,no vin and no code.Looks like they just took a RA III block of the rack and stamped the 303 on the face.Tom

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