[Scott Stoneburg]

I'm feeling like the post got side tracked by some dislike for Bill and some people's opinions on the cam. It may be a little big for the combo. But, from what's been said the car went faster with this cam before the head change. Also, you can just look at the ET difference of .18 from a lowly (junk)455 compared to this 505. Without seeing the mph difference between the 2. The 455 is doing with converter and gearing, the 505 probably would have benefitted from more converter and shown a much better ET. But that's just speculation. The HP difference from 6.80s-6.90s at 98 mph to 6.70s at 102 ( guessing at the mph values) is significant.
Just my .02

[Scott Stoneburg]

Back to Mike's car, what converter is in it? Maybe too tight for what the motor wants.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Scott Stoneburg

I'm feeling like the post got side tracked by some dislike for Bill and some people's opinions on the cam. It may be a little big for the combo. But, from what's been said the car went faster with this cam before the head change. Also, you can just look at the ET difference of .18 from a lowly (junk)455 compared to this 505. Without seeing the mph difference between the 2. The 455 is doing with converter and gearing, the 505 probably would have benefitted from more converter and shown a much better ET. But that's just speculation. The HP difference from 6.80s-6.90s at 98 mph to 6.70s at 102 ( guessing at the mph values) is significant.
Just my .02

X2. The CV1 s ran 107.9 I believe Bill said that the CV1a were up about 3 1/2 to 4 MPH which would have made the KRE HP @ close to 104 MPH.

Stan

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Scott Stoneburg

I'm feeling like the post got side tracked by some dislike for Bill and some people's opinions on the cam. It may be a little big for the combo. But, from what's been said the car went faster with this cam before the head change. Also, you can just look at the ET difference of .18 from a lowly (junk)455 compared to this 505. Without seeing the mph difference between the 2. The 455 is doing with converter and gearing, the 505 probably would have benefitted from more converter and shown a much better ET. But that's just speculation. The HP difference from 6.80s-6.90s at 98 mph to 6.70s at 102 ( guessing at the mph values) is significant.
Just my .02

Good post Scott but I don't think it has to do with any dislike for Bill. Maybe it's Bill's dislike for questions thrown at him in regards to his results. He has the attitude of any question asked makes you a CV1 hater and you should be censored. (Sound familiar)

I had to ask the guy four times who a gentleman is that Bill implied was intelligent. I recieved three responses before one answered my question. That is why the thread went sideways. Dcar had the same issue in regards to the camshaft being used. Bill initially implied a smart guy by the name of Kevin Sweeney selected the cam and then labeled D'car as a CV1 hater and he should be censored also. One must abide by Bill's wisdom because he knows all and is never wrong. I personally feel the cam leaves a lot on the table but explained why Kevin Swaney may have thought it would be a good choice.

In the spirit of this thread I will ask a question, hopefully I am not labeled a CV1 hater and am not censored but it is something related to the "back to back" results:

If it took more than four years from the time the Hi-ports were run and the current passes with the same combination..... We're the tires the same one used previously?

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by twinturrbo406

… that makes no sense …

OK, I will start here with you this morning. How fast have you ever been down the track and how many passes have you made with a 1.1292 60 FOOTS ! ??
I have been down the track way over 1000 times and the best 60' I have ever had was a 1.42 and let me tell you, you are stuck to the seat and can't keep your left foot fully planted on the floorboard. All your pressure is on the gas pedal, its really fun.
If you are a drag racer, especially if you build everything on the car yourself like me and you see a 1.1292 60 foot in a door car your years get kinda big. I imagine your eyes might get blurry for a split second, wheels up and looking at air, kind of violent.
Do you know how hard that is ? How much effort that takes ?
I posted that because you were implying Paul was a "hater" when in fact he was involved with a very impressive CV-1 car . Did you look at that thread ? Did you see all the "nice job" comments and noticed the stature of some of those posters ? Best of the Pontiac best many on them.
Its not a 6 second car like Mikes, its not even a 5 second car. Its a freaking stock block car running 4s. A little 4.155 bore short block a lot like the one I just put together.
Being impressive makes nothing but sense.
Also tells me that canted valve helps out that small bore.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

OK, I will start here with you this morning. How fast have you ever been down the track and how many passes have you made with a 1.1292 60 FOOTS ! ??
I have been down the track way over 1000 times and the best 60' I have ever had was a 1.42 and let me tell you, you are stuck to the seat and can't keep your left foot fully planted on the floorboard. All your pressure is on the gas pedal, its really fun.
If you are a drag racer, especially if you build everything on the car yourself like me and you see a 1.1292 60 foot in a door car your years get kinda big. I imagine your eyes might get blurry for a split second, wheels up and looking at air, kind of violent.
Do you know how hard that is ? How much effort that takes ?
I posted that because you were implying Paul was a "hater" when in fact he was involved with a very impressive CV-1 car . Did you look at that thread ? Did you see all the "nice job" comments and noticed the stature of some of those posters ? Best of the Pontiac best many on them.
Its not a 6 second car like Mikes, its not even a 5 second car. Its a freaking stock block car running 4s. A little 4.155 bore short block a lot like the one I just put together.
Being impressive makes nothing but sense.
Also tells me that canted valve helps out that small bore.

Interest how your posts always seem to turn to you and the great things you are doing.

Can not wait to hear you reasoning when it can not run 137 MPH in the 1/4 when this one does it in the 1/8.

Stan

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by twinturrbo406

… lol, I would agree you know a “little” 👍🏻 …
… please show me where I stated I thought that cam was ideal ?? …
… you talking to me like I’m somehow your lesser is really entertaining though 🤣 …
… please continue 👍🏻 …
… but I will ask, what does all this have to do with the fact Mike’s car is now considerably faster with unported CV-1’s ?? …
… that’s what this thread is about, right ?? …

Bill, if you get the idea that I am talking down to you maybe its because you tried to imply some guy I do not even know is smarter than I am.
Maybe he is in the upper 10%, I don't know. IQ has little to do with this when all anyone needs to do is punch numbers into a free program and you will get close.
IMO Mikes car went faster in large part because that cam was too big for the top end. Those things are not really a 380cfm head. @ 1" they could not get 380cfm. Like I said, more like a 350cfm head with any kind of cam a sane person is going to use.
Anyone who runs a 1" lift cam has far better heads than those High Ports or your CV-1s in those configurations.
That pedestrian 60' with the high trap speed tells you a lot. And just because his car ran faster does not mean any head is better than the other. Combo was off.
Do I think he could run a better than a 1.45 60" with a 6.45 with the right combo running E heads, High Ports or CV-1s, yes. It does not really matter.

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Interest how your posts always seem to turn to you and the great things you are doing.

Can not wait to hear you reasoning when it can not run 137 MPH in the 1/4 when this one does it in the 1/8.

Stan

What is wrong with you Stan ? The reference was to a puny little stock block stroker making 850 NA horsepower. That is very impressive to me and I will not make anything close to it and will not go a fast in the 1/4 as that thing did in the 1/8 "letting of the gas".
Kinda the point.

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by PAUL K

Bill I'm honestly thrilled that some of the "high profile" people in this industry are concerned about my posts on PY.

There are few folks in this industry that know of you, who did get a kick out of listening to your exit interview (that you posted on the Internet) when you were fired at Mondello's, although it is sad when anyone looses their job. Especially when it's the one guy who will "out work all these other guys" and had no responsibility for the engines blowing up on the dyno.

Please ask your coward ex-convict buddy Byron to come on here and point out where this took place in this thread

" someone has back to back results from parts changes and thier car goes quicker or not, if anyone cuts down the person personally for them making a parts change, "

Also let him know there is zero jealousy of a man that got fired from every good job he landed and has to work three jobs to make ends meet.... I'm talking about you, not Byron he has never had a good job. That's why he landed in jail.

… you’re out of your mind if you believe that nonsense, the Mondello thing yes concerning my exit but I’ve never blown up an engine on anyone’s Dyno, but you have zero clue what you’re talking about concerning that situation and yet you talk like you are the expert on the matter, as for Sonny’s I quit Sonny’s and worked out a notice, and the reason for that and the 3 jobs is because I moved back to Florida to take care of my father after he had a stroke and surgery 👍🏻 …
… but apparently you think you know the circumstances of my life more than I do, carry on sir…

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

Bill, if you get the idea that I am talking down to you maybe its because you tried to imply some guy I do not even know is smarter than I am.
Maybe he is in the upper 10%, I don't know. IQ has little to do with this when all anyone needs to do is punch numbers into a free program and you will get close.
IMO Mikes car went faster in large part because that cam was too big for the top end. Those things are not really a 380cfm head. @ 1" they could not get 380cfm. Like I said, more like a 350cfm head with any kind of cam a sane person is going to use.
Anyone who runs a 1" lift cam has far better heads than those High Ports or your CV-1s in those configurations.
That pedestrian 60' with the high trap speed tells you a lot. And just because his car ran faster does not mean any head is better than the other. Combo was off.
Do I think he could run a better than a 1.45 60" with a 6.45 with the right combo running E heads, High Ports or CV-1s, yes. It does not really matter.

… you’ve always tried to talk above me, that didn’t just start in this thread, and again I’ll explain that I never once gave my opinion of Kevin good or bad, I simply asked if you felt you’re smarter than him …
… simple as a free program huh ? Ok, use your free program and tell me what the cam looks like to make an 828ci ProStock combo with 720cfm heads, 2.750 intake valve, and 16 to 1+ compression make well over 2000hp NA ??? …
… and about the flow testing, by your words are you calling me a liar ?? Regardless of what the 380HP head flows on a smaller bore the 378cfm shown is exactly what they flowed on a 4.375 bore, an that’s a fact ����…
… and now you’re saying Mike’s results are not valid or real meaning the CV-1’s he’s using are not any better than the heads they replaced because the combo is “off” ?? … but yet it pick up 3 tenths in the 1/8th after the new heads ??
… you have to see how ridiculous you sound right ?? You can’t be that blind, I refuse to believe that, bias yes but not blind to it, that’s just crazy talk …
… do I think a set of standard pushrod Eheads ported or not out run Mike’s CV-1’s in his car ?? No I do not ���� …
… and you’re wrong, it actually matters a lot …

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

OK, I will start here with you this morning. How fast have you ever been down the track and how many passes have you made with a 1.1292 60 FOOTS ! ??
I have been down the track way over 1000 times and the best 60' I have ever had was a 1.42 and let me tell you, you are stuck to the seat and can't keep your left foot fully planted on the floorboard. All your pressure is on the gas pedal, its really fun.
If you are a drag racer, especially if you build everything on the car yourself like me and you see a 1.1292 60 foot in a door car your years get kinda big. I imagine your eyes might get blurry for a split second, wheels up and looking at air, kind of violent.
Do you know how hard that is ? How much effort that takes ?
I posted that because you were implying Paul was a "hater" when in fact he was involved with a very impressive CV-1 car . Did you look at that thread ? Did you see all the "nice job" comments and noticed the stature of some of those posters ? Best of the Pontiac best many on them.
Its not a 6 second car like Mikes, its not even a 5 second car. Its a freaking stock block car running 4s. A little 4.155 bore short block a lot like the one I just put together.
Being impressive makes nothing but sense.
Also tells me that canted valve helps out that small bore.

… first WTH does any of what you just said have to do with anything other than your hatred for me ?? …
… have I ever been down the track in really fast cars yes I have, a lot actually, apparently well faster than you, but again that doesn’t make any sense here, I design cylinder heads and manifolds primarily, funny how you seem to just gloss over the topic of port dynamics like actual shaping technique or sizing percentages or even flow bench testing, I bet you couldn’t run an SF1020 if your life depended on it 👍🏻 …
… but yet here you are, trying to talk down to me like always …

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

What is wrong with you Stan ? The reference was to a puny little stock block stroker making 850 NA horsepower. That is very impressive to me and I will not make anything close to it and will not go a fast in the 1/4 as that thing did in the 1/8 "letting of the gas".
Kinda the point.

… and exactly what does that have to do with Mike’s GTO ??? …
… ANSWER IS NOTHING 👍🏻 …

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

X2. The CV1 s ran 107.9 I believe Bill said that the CV1a were up about 3 1/2 to 4 MPH which would have made the KRE HP @ close to 104 MPH.

Stan

Not quite that much, mph wise, almost 3mph improvement 👍🏻

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Scott Stoneburg

Back to Mike's car, what converter is in it? Maybe too tight for what the motor wants.

This is what Mike texted me about his car …

“”” 65 GTO 3550 lbs ; 4:10 12 bolt ; old 28-10.5 bias slicks ; solid roller cam .727 intake .676 exhaust ; duration @.050 I-285 E-298 ; around 11-1 compression 93 octane pump gas ; 8" converter PTC ; reverse manual 400 tranny ; 505 MR1 ; 4.35 bore ; 4.25 crank ; 6.8 Crower Sportsman rods ;”””

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by twinturrbo406

…

Mondello thing yes concerning my exit but I’ve never blown up an engine on anyone’s Dyno,

That's the same thing you told your boss.... It was all the other guys fault when the engines blew up... He didn't believe you either.

Hey ask your ex-con buddy Byron why he is disrespecting another guys Pontiac efforts. According to the chicken-chit coward no one is supposed to do that.

Let him know he has my permission to use this picture for his FB page and make a post on "How to be a hypocrite"

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Scott Stoneburg

I'm feeling like the post got side tracked by some dislike for Bill and some people's opinions on the cam. It may be a little big for the combo. But, from what's been said the car went faster with this cam before the head change. Also, you can just look at the ET difference of .18 from a lowly (junk)455 compared to this 505. Without seeing the mph difference between the 2. The 455 is doing with converter and gearing, the 505 probably would have benefitted from more converter and shown a much better ET. But that's just speculation. The HP difference from 6.80s-6.90s at 98 mph to 6.70s at 102 ( guessing at the mph values) is significant.
Just my .02

… you couldn’t more on point with that, and believe me this is nothing new here, these individuals have been well not haters of anything CV-1 and myself included, they try to mask it with nonsense but the majority see right through this stuff, even trying to accuse me of not wanting to answer questions about the very car I made the post about, which is absurd, I’ve answered every quest to the best of my ability but that not good enough, they want to put words in my mouth a shift this into a 2 point debate, the CV-1 performance isn’t real and I’m nothing more than an idiot with a die grinder that gets fired from every job he’s ever had 🤣🤣…

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by twinturrbo406

… and exactly what does that have to do with Mike’s GTO ??? …
… ANSWER IS NOTHING 👍🏻 …

It does not have anything to do with Mikes car, you are right.
What it has to do with is Paul was involved with a very impressive CV build and deserves the credit for doing a fine job and not being a CV-1 hater.
No one hates you Bill, I wish the best for you.

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by PAUL K

That's the same thing you told your boss.... It was all the other guys fault when the engines blew up... He didn't believe you either.

Hey ask your ex-con buddy Byron why he is disrespecting another guys Pontiac efforts. According to the chicken-chit coward no one is supposed to do that.

Let him know he has my permission to use this picture for his FB page and make a post on "How to be a hypocrite"

… you sir are talking straight out of your ass if you believe any of what you’re saying in relation to that Paul, you’re making a big mistake going down that path, that is not the truth …
… and WTH are you bringing up Byron for god sake ??? What is wrong with you man, this thread is about Mike Moak’s CV-1 results and you’re throwing **** all over the place, and you accuse me of being a drunken idiot ???? …

[twinturrbo406]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

It does not have anything to do with Mikes car, you are right.
What it has to do with is Paul was involved with a very impressive CV build and deserves the credit for doing a fine job and not being a CV-1 hater.
No one hates you Bill, I wish the best for you.

… involved ??? In what way ?? …

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by twinturrbo406

… you’ve always tried to talk above me, that didn’t just start in this thread, and again I’ll explain that I never once gave my opinion of Kevin good or bad, I simply asked if you felt you’re smarter than him …
… simple as a free program huh ? Ok, use your free program and tell me what the cam looks like to make an 828ci ProStock combo with 720cfm heads, 2.750 intake valve, and 16 to 1+ compression make well over 2000hp NA ??? …
… and about the flow testing, by your words are you calling me a liar ?? Regardless of what the 380HP head flows on a smaller bore the 378cfm shown is exactly what they flowed on a 4.375 bore, an that’s a fact ����…
… and now you’re saying Mike’s results are not valid or real meaning the CV-1’s he’s using are not any better than the heads they replaced because the combo is “off” ?? … but yet it pick up 3 tenths in the 1/8th after the new heads ??
… you have to see how ridiculous you sound right ?? You can’t be that blind, I refuse to believe that, bias yes but not blind to it, that’s just crazy talk …
… do I think a set of standard pushrod Eheads ported or not out run Mike’s CV-1’s in his car ?? No I do not ���� …
… and you’re wrong, it actually matters a lot …

...How could I feel I am smarter than some man I have not met ? I am sure the man is not stupid. Why even ask
the question ?
,,,The cam is too big, so I said it. There are Wide Port pump gas 505s with over 850 HP around with cams that have 20 deg less duration.
,,, I do not know much about Pro Stock mountain motors. You know more about ports than I do OK.
Me talking about those KRE heads have nothing to do with you. I have never been impressed by their CNC stuff. That is what I was trying to say.
...Mikes results are real.
....std pushrod E heads are not a fair compassion to CV-1s. Non cookie cutter Wide Ports are.
...I have never tried to run a flow bench. But you are a human being and learned how to do it. Same applies for me.