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#1
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When is a Pontiac, not a Pontiac anymore ??
... I'm curious to hear/read what others feel about when does a Pontiac stop being a Pontiac ?? ...
... we all have our own opinions, but I think it could be useful/interesting information concerning not just cylinder head design, but block design also ?? ... ... what do you guys think ?? ... |
#2
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I feel if it retains the front timing cover (Or a modified version w/ a more modern water pump) and a reasonable facsimile of the lifter valley cover.....it's a Pontiac.
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#3
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It will always be a Pontiac..... Just call it an after market Pontiac if its got the good stuff on it?
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My Half AN Injun..... |
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to charlie66 For This Useful Post: | ||
#4
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Quote:
Quote:
... I tend to think that Bore-Space is the key to it still being a Pontiac, imo, as there have been a multitude of cylinder heads designed by Pontiac (SOHC, Hemi, RA-V, etc.) over the years, different deck height blocks, bore & stroke obviously has changed, reverse cooling, EFI, valve angles too, but as far as I know the bore-space has remained ... ... I don't know of any significant changes to the lifter/cam area, but maybe I'm wrong ... |
#5
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My first knee jerk answer would be, anything beyond a round port E-head should have a Modified in front of PMD. On second thought, the RA-V opens up the door to all the cylinder head SciFi Madness.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFCM6TZgTMI
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Bull Nose Formula-461, 6x-4, Q-jet, HEI, TH400, 8.5 3.08, superslowjunk |
#6
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if you can move the bore space a slight bit within the same block dimensions with same main spacing and an old d port head bolts on its a pontiac. I went to a machine shop and they had a windowed top fuel block with old 440 heads on it on display lol. It was still a mopar to me!
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#7
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Quote:
Stan
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Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#8
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I saw Bert Straus's Pontiac Pro Stock Astre "Chief Chilly Willy" at Englishtown in 1974 where it qualified very well. It had Pontiac iron heads on it but the ports were somewhere else. But at the time everyone still called it a Pontiac.
Stan
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Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#9
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If factory heads will bolt onto the block I'm good ... until a 4.90" bore spacing block is available.
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#10
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1982
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3 Generations of "Beach Boys Racing" ! Everybody knows somthin. Nobody knows everything ! 1st time on a dragstrip, 1964. Flagstart ! "Thanks for the entertainment." "Real Indians Don't Wear Bowties" |
#11
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We all get better with age because of are experiences . So does this mean we are not that person anymore , or are we just evolved . So I think if were still buying Pontiac parts for it, its still a Pontiac . So what if they look different. That's the price you pay for making something better.. I still call my mother my mother . And she looks a lot different now then when I was 10... Ok ill stop now. This getting a little out of hand.. Lol! I hope you get what im trying to say........ Im sure I'm going to get ranked on for this one. Lol...
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My Half AN Injun..... Last edited by charlie66; 12-28-2013 at 05:04 PM. |
The Following User Says Thank You to charlie66 For This Useful Post: | ||
#12
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... so what's the opinion on lifter-bore design/placement and cam tunnel design changes ?? ... as in moved lifter bores, size options, cam journal design changes ?? ...
... Pontiac or not Pontiac ?? ... |
#13
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I remember seeing "PMD" on some older Pontiacs, which stood for Pontiac MOTOR Division.
Of course, it could no longer be a "motor" division of GM after 1981, so it effectively became the Pontiac Design Division of GM. Regardless of era, the Pontiac version of whatever GM allowed them to produce was always more attractive than the Chevy version. That said, I prefer for PMD-era Pontiacs to STILL be powered by Pontiac (exceptions being for F-bodies that came with 403 Olds from the factory, I give them a waiver).
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'73 T/A (clone). Low budget stock headed 8.3:1 455, 222/242 116lsa .443/.435 cam. FAST Sportsman EFI, 315rwhp/385rwtq on 87 octane. 13.12 @103.2, 1.91 60'. '67 Firebird [sold], ; 11.27 @ 119.61, 7.167 @ 96.07, with UD 280/280 (108LSA/ 109 ICL)solid cam. [1.537, 7.233 @93.61, 11.46 @ 115.4 w/ old UD 288/296 108 hydraulic cam] Feb '05 HPP, home-ported "16" D-ports, dished pistons (pump gas only), 3.42 gears, 275/60 DR's, 750DP, T2, full exhaust |
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Lee For This Useful Post: | ||
#14
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If it is OK to move cam lobes around to change the firing order then anything inside of the block to do with the cam for me is fair game. Stan
__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#15
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"I still have my Great Grandfathers shovel. Its had 5 new handles and 2 new heads, but its still his".
In racing every part is modified or massaged, as long as you're not putting a BBC or other brand motor in it you're good with me. |
The Following User Says Thank You to David Holmberg For This Useful Post: | ||
#16
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... I agree David, but while I have you here, you think you can look into my profile, as I am not able to send PM's for some reason ?? ... I can respond to them, but that's all ... ... thanks ... |
#17
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The way I see it Pontiac is dead and gone,make new products anyway you want.
None of the car makers run the same engine designs from 40 years ago or longer. Maybe you could call certain parts nostalgia or traditional and then have parts listed as newly designed modern technology parts for aftermarket Pontiac . Bottom line the market for improved technology Pontiac parts is very small,someone could probably make more money producing and selling cast iron d-port reproduction heads than any of the other heads on the market. A 300 cfm iron head with plenty of material left for durability and better cooling would sell really well,sad but true.
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Car Craft Garage. Automotive Restoration |
#18
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PONTIAC
ONES PERCEPTION IS HIS REALITY just like THE METALFINISHER SAID AT THE 1978 GTO NATIONALS YOU CAN BELIEVE OR DISBELIEVE WHATEVER YOU WANT BUT I KNOW WHAT I HAVE BUILT:jumpin g:
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#19
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Yes - IA II and MR1 Blocks - pure Pontiac - which are run in this 7 sec. GTO & 7 sec. GXP
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The Bandit Rules - Make mine with a SD-455 Engine . |
#20
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Factory bore spacing, ten head bolts= Pontiac
Beyond that, purpose built aftermarket racing engine. 1000 people, 1000 different opinions. Not wrong, just different. The above is mine.
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Jack Ferris RestoRacing LLC www.restoracing.com Sandy, UT --------------------------------------------------- |
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