I was optimistic , *sigh*

[GTO_2004]

that this section of the PY board would be for people that where interested in the '04 GTO.. to share their stories and experiences... and that it could grow into something to be proud of... maybe get sponsors interested and even generate some sales (wishfull thinking?)

at the moment i am far from proud of how its turning out.

don't get me wrong, i want it to be fair and will cop critisism of the GTO on the chin, but it seems some people just like to bitch and moan and cause trouble RE the new car, i mean if you don't like it isn't it logical to have your say; "it sux" or "bland" etc etc and move along to a part of the board that interests you instead of just hanging around and just repeating the same old thing.

some of the pro '04 crowd can get monotonous as well, it goes both ways.

I'm friends with people that don't care for the '04 as well as the people that like it.

i just wish the threats and fighting would stop.

any suggestions on how we could all get along ?

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

[GTO_2004]

that this section of the PY board would be for people that where interested in the '04 GTO.. to share their stories and experiences... and that it could grow into something to be proud of... maybe get sponsors interested and even generate some sales (wishfull thinking?)

at the moment i am far from proud of how its turning out.

don't get me wrong, i want it to be fair and will cop critisism of the GTO on the chin, but it seems some people just like to bitch and moan and cause trouble RE the new car, i mean if you don't like it isn't it logical to have your say; "it sux" or "bland" etc etc and move along to a part of the board that interests you instead of just hanging around and just repeating the same old thing.

some of the pro '04 crowd can get monotonous as well, it goes both ways.

I'm friends with people that don't care for the '04 as well as the people that like it.

i just wish the threats and fighting would stop.

any suggestions on how we could all get along ?

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

I agree, some people just want to keep beating the drum.how hard is it to express your opinion. without the childish name calling and threats.

Support bacteria. They're the only culture some people have.
------------------------------ Je suis blanc, age 18 a 55 ans. Tout le monde m'ecoute! Peu importe la stupidite de mes suggestions.

[455HOGT37]

Well, I was going to stay away from all this until I had some facts to back up my initial opinion of the car. I drove one today and I am prepared to report how seeing it in person has changed my mind.

It does look better in person... A little. From some angles it is down right bland yet from at least one, it looked pretty mean.

The exhaust sounds good.. Almost like a real Pontiac.

The rear wing is very gay... It does look like it would unbolt easily though. That and $500.00 worth of body and paint work to fix the damage would solve that.

The steering is suprisingly slow. My Yukon has quicker steering.

The seats feel pretty good, but the overall interior quality is not what I was led to expect. Not bad, but I think the Yukon tops it again. One thing I am sure of: There will be very few BMW owners switching to this car anytime soon. "World class", my ass!

The back seats are a pain to get into, but offer pretty good room. The all electric seat movement is glacier slow. This will make it a bad candidate for a getaway car from a bank robbery.

I find the windshield pillars obtrusive, but not nearly as bad as the last F body.

The trunk is not as bad as I thought, but still small.

Overall, I find it a acceptable product that does not deserve all the hype. It's a solid middle of the road performer on the "I gotta have it scale". I am undecided if I will purchase one, but if I do, the stick on badges are going to come off. I just can't bring myself to call it a Pontiac GTO with a clear conscience.
And that is a fact.

[GTO_2004]

ok .. that was a good review, even if it was mostly negative, you made some good points and pontiac will hopefully improve on in the '05 model.

overall though , the power ,the room, the quality (even if it isn't quite BMW) should be better than anything else avail for the money.

and you can even comfortably fit two adults or 2 baby seats in the back..



Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

[455HOGT37]

I have driven a bunch of midsize GM products (rental) in the last few years because I do a lot of company travel. This car is far superior to all of them. My review sounded negative because I was interested in the much touted high points, and I had high expectations. Just like I thought all along, it seems a solid performer, but it does not establish the high water mark for automotive excellence either. I'm not so sure it is a great value at sticker price... Seems more like a 25k vehicle. I'm certain there will be a few sold close to invoice before long. The one I drove (auto trans)was right at MSRP today, but last week had a 5k premium.

[Mr_GTO]

Hmmmm, my parents have a Suburban that is real nice but the interior in that couldn't compare to the GTO that I looked at last week. I think the interior of the car is it's best feature.

I think if you drove the 6spd and had it longer than just a short test drive, I think you might appreciate it a bit more.

[HUMBLER]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GTO_2004:
ok .. that was a good review, even if it was mostly negative, you made some good points and pontiac will hopefully improve on in the '05 model.

overall though , the power ,the room, the quality (even if it isn't quite BMW) should be better than anything else avail for the money.

and you can even comfortably fit two adults or 2 baby seats in the back..

http://www.micro-op.com.au/execls1/kids.jpg

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

THANK YOU FOR THAT PIC! My wife is going to love this...

"the Humbler...the Humbler...G...T...O!"

[disc0monkey]

my gloves are up see u guys in 2005

[455HOGT37]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr_GTO:

I think if you drove the 6spd and had it longer than just a short test drive, I think you might appreciate it a bit more.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No doubt about that. However, the Yukon hooked me 30 seconds into the test drive, while the Holden did not have that power. How does the saying go- "You only have one chance to make a first impression"?

I am taking my bride to look at it today, however.

[ChiefIronHorse]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 455HOGT37:
Well, I was going to stay away from all this until I had some facts to back up my initial opinion of the car. I drove one today and I am prepared to report how seeing it in person has changed my mind.

It does look better in person... A little. From some angles it is down right bland yet from at least one, it looked pretty mean.

The exhaust sounds good.. Almost like a real Pontiac.

The rear wing is very gay... It does look like it would unbolt easily though. That and $500.00 worth of body and paint work to fix the damage would solve that.

The steering is suprisingly slow. My Yukon has quicker steering.

The seats feel pretty good, but the overall interior quality is not what I was led to expect. Not bad, but I think the Yukon tops it again. One thing I am sure of: There will be very few BMW owners switching to this car anytime soon. "World class", my ass!

The back seats are a pain to get into, but offer pretty good room. The all electric seat movement is glacier slow. This will make it a bad candidate for a getaway car from a bank robbery.

I find the windshield pillars obtrusive, but not nearly as bad as the last F body.

The trunk is not as bad as I thought, but still small.

Overall, I find it a acceptable product that does not deserve all the hype. It's a solid middle of the road performer on the "I gotta have it scale". I am undecided if I will purchase one, but if I do, the stick on badges are going to come off. I just can't bring myself to call it a Pontiac GTO with a clear conscience.
And that is a fact. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No... that's your opinion!

[ChiefIronHorse]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 455HOGT37:
I have driven a bunch of midsize GM products (rental) in the last few years because I do a lot of company travel. This car is far superior to all of them. My review sounded negative because I was interested in the much touted high points, and I had high expectations. Just like I thought all along, it seems a solid performer, but it does not establish the high water mark for automotive excellence either. I'm not so sure it is a great value at sticker price... Seems more like a 25k vehicle. I'm certain there will be a few sold close to invoice before long. The one I drove (auto trans)was right at MSRP today, but last week had a 5k premium.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just curious Hog, how many vehicles can you purchase with an LS1 V-8 for around 25k?

[455HOGT37]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr. Iron Horse:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 455HOGT37:

...I just can't bring myself to call it a Pontiac GTO with a clear conscience.
And that is a fact. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No... that's your opinion! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nope, Fact!

[455HOGT37]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr. Iron Horse:

Just curious Hog, how many vehicles can you purchase with an LS1 V-8 for around 25k?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

New? None that I am aware of. And that is the exact same number of new Holdens that I will pay MSRP for. They will not sustain MSRP pricing for long.

[Goathead]

So, now the pro '04 Holden guy's can read our conscience.

I did not know that...



http://www.dannys65gto.com

http://kurtspontiac.homestead.com/dannys65gto.html

[GTO_2004]

danny you don't like the '04 , we know.

but does it take anything a way from your '65? which i just finished reading your website,and that thing is a beauty, not denying it.

of course me admiring your car will bring comments from you like - " its better than that POS new one" they are not meant to be directly compared (different time and era), but people can't understand that ...

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

[Goathead]

Yes, in a way that is correct. But my real problem with the "new" version that is being pushed on consumers is that it is not new in any way, now is it? An old engine design, and old chassis and body style, basically an old established Australian car sporting new "GTO" emblems.

That is my problem with the new "GTO", there is really nothing new about it, and it is really not unique in any way.

I am sure someone will tell me how wrong I am, but I know all too well, that I am not, at least in my own mind.

I cannot speak for anyone else, but go ahead and speak for me, I am getting used to it....

PS, thanks for visiting my site, and the compliment.


http://www.dannys65gto.com

http://kurtspontiac.homestead.com/dannys65gto.html

[GTO_2004]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
An old engine design, and old chassis and body style, basically an old established Australian car sporting new "GTO" emblems.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

that statement is not 100% correct.

the chassis is not that old, and has been updated by holden in its latest guise, and besides the GM2800 chasis has the uncanny ability to outdo ones that are supposedly more advanced, and the feel from the driver's seat is very predictable and forgiving.

the engine design is old ? i hope youre not refering to OHV vs OHC or DOHC, because overhead cam engines have been around just as long.

and lastly and possibly most signifacntly you have a problem that its made in aussie ? to this i have no reply.

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

I don't want to put words in goatheads mouth. but I think what he is saying. is the original. was based on a new concept. of large engine in a smaller light body.all the new one is. regardless of the fact. that its made outside the country. It is an existing car, brought here and a name change. to something americans can associate it to.thats an issue with me. and I think a lot of gto people would agree.

Support bacteria. They're the only culture some people have.
------------------------------ Je suis blanc, age 18 a 55 ans. Tout le monde m'ecoute! Peu importe la stupidite de mes suggestions.

[GTO_2004]

ok , i see your points... and you guys are right, its not the perfect car, and it was an existing model(in aussie).

I understand that, but what i do like is that they(pontiac)have stated that this is a first of a new lineage of GTO's that is to follow, maybe the first one was a bit rushed.(not the car itself which should'nt have teething problems, but the image of what a GTO should be visually, like scoops, tach , dual exhausts, so on that part i also agree.) maybe they needed to make it by the 40th anniversary ?

the fact that it is aussie based for now, does not take away from the car especially knowing that we have persisted with RWD V8's even in our famaily sedans compared to FWD's that were accepted there.

all i am saying is it could've been alot worse, and the future ones might be worse off in quality or design or could be better, who knows, just like the classic GTO's everyone has their favourite.

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

[This message was edited by GTO_2004 on January 29, 2004 at 02:22 AM.]