[242177P]

Originally Posted by DANTIP

I recall reading a post on this site in February of this year where someone described a horrific experience with a flu-pneumonia. I think they were 40 years old and thought they were literally going to die. I wonder if they could have had coronavirus and not known what it was??

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=837814

[Trulyvintage]

I have been doing my own research:

You might find this interesting:

@ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred...esearch_Center

@ https://www.fredhutch.org/en/coronavirus-overview.html

@ https://www.fredhutch.org/en/news/ce...r-bedford.html


Jim

[Jonsie]

In 1918, children would skip-rope to this little rhyme: "I had a little bird, its name was Enza. I opened the window, and in-flew-Enza".

[cdrookie]

Infections

COVID-19: Approximately 207,518 cases worldwide; 7,324 cases in the U.S. as of Mar. 18, 2020.*

Flu: Estimated 1 billion cases worldwide; 9.3 million to 45 million cases in the U.S. per year.

Deaths

COVID-19: Approximately 8,248 deaths reported worldwide; 115 deaths in the U.S., as of Mar. 18, 2020.*

Flu: 291,000 to 646,000 deaths worldwide; 12,000 to 61,000 deaths in the U.S. per year.

The COVID-19 situation is changing rapidly. Since this disease is caused by a new virus, people do not have immunity to it, and a vaccine may be many months away. Doctors and scientists are working on estimating the mortality rate of COVID-19, but at present, it is thought to be higher than that of most strains of the flu.

-John Hopkins Center for Systems Science and Engineering


I'm sure it's been said in this thread but I'm not reading through 9 pages of it. How's come none of this shutdown stay home BS has been done before? This Flu disease thing looks pretty stout, looks like it's been around a while, our bodies have built up immunity, AND there's a vaccine!!! But human beings are losing their lives every year because of it. COVID-19 has a LONG ways to go to catch up. If there was something else going on in the world to keep the media occupied this wouldn't even be an issue. The real virus is Media Diarrhea and there's no known cure. I use to think I'd be dead before this country is completely ****** but after seeing this fiasco unfold, the sad truth is I was wrong.

[Will]

Originally Posted by cdrookie

Infections

COVID-19: Approximately 207,518 cases worldwide; 7,324 cases in the U.S. as of Mar. 18, 2020.*

Flu: Estimated 1 billion cases worldwide; 9.3 million to 45 million cases in the U.S. per year.

Deaths

COVID-19: Approximately 8,248 deaths reported worldwide; 115 deaths in the U.S., as of Mar. 18, 2020.*

Flu: 291,000 to 646,000 deaths worldwide; 12,000 to 61,000 deaths in the U.S. per year.

The COVID-19 situation is changing rapidly. Since this disease is caused by a new virus, people do not have immunity to it, and a vaccine may be many months away. Doctors and scientists are working on estimating the mortality rate of COVID-19, but at present, it is thought to be higher than that of most strains of the flu.

-John Hopkins Center for Systems Science and Engineering


I'm sure it's been said in this thread but I'm not reading through 9 pages of it. How's come none of this shutdown stay home BS has been done before? This Flu disease thing looks pretty stout, looks like it's been around a while, our bodies have built up immunity, AND there's a vaccine!!! But human beings are losing their lives every year because of it. COVID-19 has a LONG ways to go to catch up. If there was something else going on in the world to keep the media occupied this wouldn't even be an issue. The real virus is Media Diarrhea and there's no known cure. I use to think I'd be dead before this country is completely ****** but after seeing this fiasco unfold, the sad truth is I was wrong.

And yet, seasonal flu doesn't overwhelm first world healthcare systems and kill hundreds of people a day.

The death rate for seasonal flu is really low. The death rate for COVID19 appears to be significantly higher. The hospitalization rate for COVID19 is MUCH higher. Even healthy people are ending up in the hospital from this thing.

And the BIGGEST problem with comparing this to seasonal flu is that it's just getting started and countries are taking drastic action to curb it. You can't quote a years worth of statistics for the flu as a meaningful comparison to a few months of COVID19.

If it was left unchecked, if we did nothing to curb it's spread our healthcare system would be completely overwhelmed and millions would die within a year.

The irony of drastic measures to curb the spread is that if they work people will feel that they were unnecessary.

To paraphrase a quote I read a couple days ago:. Whatever we do at the beginning will seem like overreaction and at the end won't have been enough.

[Greg Reid]

Originally Posted by Will

The irony of drastic measures to curb the spread is that if they work people will feel that they were unnecessary.

.

I was thinking this very thought yesterday. If certain people who are being accused of not reacting fast enough or not doing enough had been clairevoyant and done everything to stop this from the very beginning, it would have been judged an overreaction.

[cdrookie]

All those other strains of the flu that were going to "kill us all" didn't cause any reaction like this. It's media driven panic. Overwhelmed health care is from everyone running to the hospital when they have a hang nail. Media says everyone is going to die if you don't lock yourself in your room. Governors calling for every place to shut down. I've had the flu before, sometimes it's hit me pretty hard, other times not so much, never once did I go seek medical treatment, or even think of doing so. The old and young are at risk from every virus that comes along, and I believe they comprise the biggest death toll from all the illnesses. I'd like to see the number of healthy people that have died from this, not people with underlying illnesses. If people want to lock themselves in their room that's fine, but don't tell me what to do. A lot of people preaching that, but have no problem going into Walmart with 400 other maniacs and buying everything on the shelf.

Now I'm off to work. Go work close to a bunch of people from different demographics who don't believe in this scare even though there's a couple hundred cases of it here.

[Steve C.]

In readying the National Guard for action, Newsom’s office emphasized that it’s for duties routinely performed during natural disasters and other emergencies. But Newsom grimly added that “we have the ability to do martial law … if we feel the necessity.”


.

[dataway]

My wife has worked at the same hospital for 25 years, from O.R. Tech, to RN in the ICU to administration. She says the vast majority of their workload is nut case hypochondriacs insisting on being tested, hospitalized, paid attention to. Flooding the phone lines, clogging up the ER etc. How many actual cases of the virus out of the hundreds that are "overwhelming" the place ..... 2.

If China is ground zero .... and if they are telling the truth .... they stopped at about 85,000 cases .... or ... 1 out of every 15,294 people (.00006 of the 1.3 billion population) ... and that's ground zero.

[Region Warrior]

If it wasn't for the news media, 90 percent of the people wouldn't even know was happening.
I say that cause 90 percent of employees I asked here don't listen to radio news or tv news till after hearing about it from other people.
75 percent still not worried. Maybe good thing, maybe bad. Time will tell.

[Steve C.]

CDC analysis shows coronavirus poses serious risk for younger people

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...younger-people

Millennials become focus of coronavirus outreach

https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...virus-outreach


Officials are telling Americans they must practice social distancing and avoid groups of more than 10 people to slow the spread of the pandemic.

But in many places, especially outside large centers, people are defying the message. Among the reasons: The urgency has been slow to become apparent; they do not believe in the steps; or their livelihoods depend on ignoring the guidance.


.

[dataway]

I would wager than the hysteria that is leading economic collapse and the end of the world fear mongering will generate more deaths from suicides than actual deaths from the virus.

[Sirrotica]

At 67 YO, I have type 2 diabetes, controlled high blood pressure, and today I'll find out if a have asthma, or COPD (never smoked in my entire lifetime) after the tests ran about 2 weeks ago. With my chronic ailments the corona virus may as well be AIDS in the 1990s, if I were to get it. Two weeks ago I also thought that people in the US were going nuts over this disease, after doing some research, plus getting info from my wife coming from her employer I'm thinking this virus is not as benign as some people think it is.

My wife is also a 25 year RN, and has worked as many, if not more positions as Dataway's wife has. She now works for United Health Care, and has been getting the information from her employer about Covid 19 for weeks. She is concerned because there is no one with any resistance to this virus, no antivirus, and very little in the way of drugs to counteract it's effects. Hospitalization, with oxygen enrichment, and a ventilator if it knocks you down, bad enough to put you in the hospital, is about as good as your defense is against it is. Not everyone is going to end up in the hospital, but if you do get knocked down that far, your odds aren't that good.

This is similar in some ways to the bubonic plague in the centuries past, where you could survive it, if you were lucky, there was zero medicine to prevent it, or cure it back then. The people of the day knew little about how it was spread. This virus has zero medicine to prevent it, or cure it. If it gets out of control, the death toll could be much higher than it is currently.

China was concerned enough about it to declare mashall law and home quarantine all the residents in, and around ground zero. Until they made it mandatory quarantine to stop the spread, they had little, if any control over it's spread until they used mandatory quarantines.

From Crusty Sarge's thread in the CH, about how things are going down in Italy, about no one taking the disease seriously, has led to 450 deaths a day from yesterdays statistics, that's up 100 people per day over last week. From his posts the people are fleeing Northern Italy, and going South, this is going to be problematic, as it will spread the disease further.

People that get the virus, and survive it, aren't going to be good as new as far as their lungs being scarred from here on out. If you think this is overblown, that's your prerogative, but from my perspective I doubt I have a good chance of surviving it if I contact it. Someone else's indifference, could be my death sentence. I'm glad the officials in the US are taking it seriously. To me it's not just the seasonal flu, I've had that, and survived it quite a few times over the years. I've also had pneumonia once, and survived it. I don't want to roll the dice with corona virus though.

One other thing about it I found out last night listening to the docs on fox news, when they do an ultrasound of your lungs you have blotches spread throughout the lungs, indicating scarring of the internal tissue of the lungs. If you survive it, you will have permanent scarring of your lungs. Seasonal flu doesn't scar the lungs permanently. Equating this disease to seasonal flu is apples and oranges, IMO.

I'm far from an alarmist, but I am staying home until they get a handle on this, and I hate being cooped up as bad as anyone does. Normally I'm out of the house everyday under normal circumstances.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by Will

And yet, seasonal flu doesn't overwhelm first world healthcare systems and kill hundreds of people a day.

The death rate for seasonal flu is really low. The death rate for COVID19 appears to be significantly higher. The hospitalization rate for COVID19 is MUCH higher. Even healthy people are ending up in the hospital from this thing.

And the BIGGEST problem with comparing this to seasonal flu is that it's just getting started and countries are taking drastic action to curb it. You can't quote a years worth of statistics for the flu as a meaningful comparison to a few months of COVID19.

If it was left unchecked, if we did nothing to curb it's spread our healthcare system would be completely overwhelmed and millions would die within a year.

The irony of drastic measures to curb the spread is that if they work people will feel that they were unnecessary.

To paraphrase a quote I read a couple days ago:. Whatever we do at the beginning will seem like overreaction and at the end won't have been enough.

Will, what is overwhelming the healthcare system are the number of cases that require ICU care along with ventilators. This accounts for less than 15% of all cases, but no hospital anywhere in the world has an ICU/ RT department that can handle this many cases at one time. The fact that the DOD has donated 5,000 vents will help, but you still need qualified RTs to run those vents and monitor patients. The clinical studies from France, South Korea and China on the use of hydroxychloroquin and azithromycin in early stage infections are promising. It going to take time to get this “bug” under control.

[bird72]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/coronavir...125000381.html

New Jersey: I think this was serious for them.

[dataway]

I still think people don't have a good grasp on the numbers .... seriously, one million people a day could die from this virus and it would still take more than 22 years to kill the population of this planet. That's not hyperbole, that the actual math.

If it kills 1 million people total, your chances of dying would still be 1 in 8000.

The current death total of 9790 is 0.00001% of the world population. If it was 100 times worse, it still wouldn't have a measurable effect on world population. More people are going to die from the panic, anxiety, depression, disruption of supply chains and isolation than will die from the virus.

Take reasonable precautions yes, social distancing ... good idea, personal hygiene good idea, work hard on a vaccine, good idea. World wide panic is a bad idea, and that's where we are headed, people are already being killed in third world nations because people "think" they are infected. This media hyperbole, when digested by the majority of uneducated people in the world will turn into violent panic. Watch what will happen in India and Africa.

When all is said and done in the US, you will have been more likely to die driving to work than from this virus.

How many people will die in vehicle accidents THIS MONTH ?? 3,046 on average. That will probably be 100 times more people than die from the virus this month.

In fact, I'll put a $20 spot on the wager that this virus NEVER kills more people in a month than the automobile fatalities.

And yet ... we'll get in our cars and drive every day.

I guess as long as the media companies are raking in billions of dollars on this panic we should just be happy for them.

[Region Warrior]

But who wants to be part of that million....
And yes, fear of my life driving with all the idiots out there.
Count at least 10-15 red lite speeders nearly every morning and evening.
Sometimes 3-4 at a time.

[bird72]

Originally Posted by dataway

I guess as long as the media companies are raking in billions of dollars on this panic we should just be happy for them.

I just don't see this media panic reporting you refer to. I see many informative and data driven articles. I see scientific, biological, medical and government articles. I think the media is getting a bad rap in this. If fear and panic are a result of reporting facts on this, then that is reactive, not motivated by. IMO, as is yours.

[67drake]

Just putting my observations out there, not really news.
I live in a small town. Nowhere to eat here. We weekly go to a local mom and pop diner in the next town over, and are friends with the owners and their daughters that waitress there. Nobody can eat there because of the lockdown , but they are still doing carry out orders. My wife went in there today to pick up lunch. The daughter working the register was literally in tears as she talked to my wife. Business is dead, and she has no idea how she’s going to pay her bills. This is her whole family’s source of income.

My wife babysits a few toddlers and babies during the day. She just started watching a 4 month old while the mom works at the town gas station. The baby has a sensitive stomach and they spent a lot of time figuring out a baby formula that didn’t upset his stomach. Well she spent all day yesterday scouring 2 counties to look for a store that wasn’t sold out of his formula due to the panic and hoarding frenzy going on. Man this kid ain’t happy! Still can’t find any.
No matter how bad things are I try to remember there are a lot of people who have it a lot worse than me.

[pont3]

Testing. I'm not sure I understand how this will help. Sure, testing will reveal how many people have it NOW, but even if you tested negative today, you could STILL be inflicted tomorrow. So I simply don't understand why testing people with no symptoms is helpful.