[Torment]

Chad, what's the magic number for bragging rights?

[dammen8]

Well the highest N/A numbers so far are 692 hp and 646 lbft of torque I have since updated the carb. The carb I was running was a out of the box 8896hp dominator, I sent it to Pro-Systems and Patrick (the owner) gauranteed me 20-30 more hp and lbft of torque (but I dont have a dyno sheet for it so it dont count) [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img] ... on just a little bump of some laughing gas with a very and I do stress very conservative tune up it made 843 hp and 792lbft of torque. They told me that it was the first time anyone had sprayed nitrous on the dyno. I had a pretty big crowd for it, Lance was there running the dyno and Jason and some of his buddies were all there to watch. All in all it was a good day.

Chad Dammen

I know the numbers are not that high but I dont think that they are to bad.

[dammen8]

Ooooppps it wasn't Jason it was Lance's other brother Ben..

Chad Dammen

[Bart]

Torment and Chad,
Thanks for all the info. I'll be contacting Lance to have my block done. Maybe I'll have him do the heads and crank too. I was planning on taking the crank to crankshaft specialties in the cities. If Lance can do just as good I'll have him do the whole works. We'll see what he says when I talk to him.

Those are some pretty impressive numbers. I don't know if I'll ever beat that but maybe someday. Maybe I'll get a chance to see it in action sometime. If I have any money left over when it's all said and done I'll have it put on the dyno and see what it does.

Is his dyno a chasis dyno? Does he have a flowbench? Does he do any head porting? I guess I could ask when I call but I'm not ready just yet. I'm going to try to get that block from Bud first.

[PHILLYGOAT]

DAMMEN8, I thought the #'s were a little low too, then I remembered this is only in the "Street Pontiacs" section, so don't feel too bad. LOL
Phil [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

[Torment]

843hp it is then [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] Ok, maybe I'll bring it down and see what it does. I used to have one of their flyers on my fridge but the wife 'cleaned' ha, ha. I've got my curve down pretty good in the car but I haven't had a chance to bring up the rear jets yet so maybe it'd be worthwhile-just convincing myself [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] I don't know if it'd show 843hp or not but I do so love friendly rivalries. I'll keep you updated. Bart, on a side note myself and my brother have been porting our own heads for over a decade. No flowbench but our cars usually manage to get out of their own way. We're finishing up helping another local guy setup a street/strip pump gas 455 and it's supposed to go to the dyno in the next month or so. If your interested we could save you a few bucks over the "pro" shops porting costs.

[Bart]

Torment,
I just might take you up on that. I was planning on doing some basic stuff myself. Polishing the chambers, unshrouding the valves, blending the bowls, removing some metal from the pushrod buldge, flattening the floor, smoothing the rest of the port, radiusing the short turn, and gasket matching. I think just doing those things would help a lot. I'd be afraid to do any more than that without experienced advice or a flowbench! If you know what works and what doesn't then maybe you could take the next step and improve upon what I do. I'm just a little nervous about someone doing more than that without a flowbench.
It doesn't mean that I wouldn't have you work on them though.

The reason I asked about a flow bench is because I know that without it you can't equalize the cc's of the ports and you can't equalize the flow. That was my biggest concern. Having different ports flow different numbers. I have heard that it will cause uneven mixture distribution and some cylinders will run rich while others will run lean. Maybe I'm being too picky. Maybe it's not as important as I think it is.

[Tom Vaught]

Have you ever thought about building your own flow bench? I helped a friend who is a retired police officer build one and his was not very hard to build or expensive and works great for what he wants to do. Let me know if you are interested as I made extra orifice plates. Tom

[Bart]

Tom,
Yes I would be very interested in doing that. I've heard of people doing it but I didn't know how reliable and accurate it would be compared to the superflows. I didn't know how much it would cost or where I could find the parts. I heard that a lot of stuff had to be fabricated and since I don't know much about using a flow bench I figured that it wasn't something that I wanted to get into. If I had step by step plans with detailed instructions and a source for parts I believe that I could do it and make it work. I would have no idea where to start though.

If you have any plans or know where I can get something that could show me how to do it please let me know. I would appreciate it very much! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

[Tom Vaught]

I will try and take some photos of my friend's
flow bench. His name is Loren Budzinski and he
is a really smart guy when it comes to pontiacs.
I have sketched hundreds of flow bench designs
up over the years. The key to the whole project is how much electrical power do you have available
as different designs take different power loads.
I designed Jim Butlers bench and one of his local
friends and I built it over the phone. Tom Wilhite
from Kansas has a state of the art bench that I
helped him build with minimum plans. It was pretty
expensive but top quality. Jim has flowed every
set of heads that have went through his shop with
his bench the last several years and it is still
working fine. Let me know more about your ideas
and I will help you out. If anyone else is in
anyway interested in building one or just gaining
knowledge of how they work let me know.
I forgot, I designed and built Marty Palbykin's
flow bench too with Bill Klausings help.

[Bart]

Tom,
It sounds like you are very knowledgeable about the flow benchs. I always thought those guys bought their flow benchs already from big companies like superflow. If those guys use your designs I'm sure that something similar would be more than satisfactory for me. I'm very impressed!

I have seen some pictures of the superflows but never had the chance to see one in operation. I know a little but not a lot. I'll tell you what I know and maybe you can fill in the missing pieces for me. This is what I know from what I've read and heard.

The head is bolted to a fixture and one of the chambers has a hole in it that matches the chamber diameter. The valve is lifted to different heights and a dial gauge is used to measure the lift. I'm not sure how the valve is actualy held open at a given lift. Modeling is used around the opening of the port to smooth the airflow and a motor creates a vaccuum that draws air through the head at a given pressure drop and a given valve height for the intake. Air is forced into the chamber for the exhaust flow. Pressure drop is usualy 28 inches of water and everything has to be air tight for accurate readings. A vacuum gauge is used to measure the pressure drop and a monometer(I think) is used to measure the airflow through the port. A velocity probe is sometimes used to see where the velocity is the highest and lowest. I'm not sure how the pressure gauge and flow gauge actualy work or where they are placed.

Thats about all I know as far as a flow bench is concerned. I don't know if you'd want any money for your plans. If it wasn't too expensive I'd pay you for one of your designs. I'd be very interested in seeing one or more of them if that's possible. Also something more technical as to a list of components and how it actualy operates would be very helpful. I can build just about anything if I have something to go by. To actualy see someone use one would also help a great deal. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[dammen8]

Hey Tom make that two of us that are interested in your plans..

Chad Dammen

[Tom Vaught]

Actually, you are very close on your basic flow
bench understanding just need some small help on
the specifics. Manometers are used to measure the
pressure drop across the test part (this is where
the 28" H2O (water) spec you mentioned comes from). A manometer is also used across the test flow orifice 6" H2O (water) spec to determine the
full scale flow for a specific orifice and what
percentage of actual flow the test part is flowing
at a certain lift of the valve. The valve is held open by a screw fixture that can be turned in a
very small increment. A velocity probe can be
used to map the port for velocity changes but you
have to be careful that the probe is not causing
the change. Superflow has used several of my ideas
in their benchs that they make. The most obvious
one is the flow Portal on their 1200 cfm bench.

[Tom Vaught]

Thanks Chad, Need the same kind of electrical info
from you. Send me an e-mail (see my profile) Tom

[Bart]

Tom,
So what's the next step. How do I proceed?
I'm not sure what your intentions are.