[Bill Hanlon]

I knew I had read that somewhere. Just looked at the Pontiac Tri-Power road test that Hot Rod Magazine did in their June 1957 issue. It uses the exact same drawing as figure 85 in my previous reference, but the text that points at the port says "INTAKE VALVE VENTED TO ATMOSPHERE" and the text under the drawing is as follows:

"Cutaway drawing from factory manual shows how the intake valves are vented to the atmosphere through the side of the head casting to prevent excessive oil consumption. Instead of oil being pulled down guides under high vacuum, air bleeds through."

[Bzltyr]

I have one of these engines in my driveway. I bought it today. The guy told me it was a 370. I want a 370.

Mine is oil pan to air cleaner with Generator, A/C and PS pump. It has all the pulleys and the trans attached. The oil looks good - no rust on the dipstick. The guy ran the engine for a minute or so and then pulled it to put in a SBC. I his defense it is not his car but a client's.

I am thinking of giving it back.

[Bill Hanlon]

Originally Posted by Bzltyr

I am thinking of giving it back.

Why?

[b-man]

Originally Posted by Bzltyr

I have one of these engines in my driveway. I bought it today. The guy told me it was a 370. I want a 370.

Mine is oil pan to air cleaner with Generator, A/C and PS pump. It has all the pulleys and the trans attached. The oil looks good - no rust on the dipstick. The guy ran the engine for a minute or so and then pulled it to put in a SBC. I his defense it is not his car but a client's.

I am thinking of giving it back.

I suppose if you have your heart set on a 370, you wouldn't want a 389.

If you need the 370 to be correct for a 1958 car, definitely hold out for a 370.

The thing I like about the 1959 389 besides the added displacement is there are more parts readily available for rebuilding them. Finding main bearings, pistons and oil pumps for the '55 -'58 engines can be difficult.

[Bzltyr]

I want the smaller main journals and the shorter stroke.

A 389 is a 400 less 0.058" bore. When I was building engines it was always, "When in doubt, bore it out." The 370 can be bored to 4.121 and use a stock 400 piston. Use a 428 piston and lengthen the connecting rod. The bore/stroke ratio and the rod/stroke ratio get real attractive. Compression ratios from 7 to 1 all the way to 12 to one are attainable.

The cost for the adapter and motor mounts are the only issue with the 370 being one of the best Pontiac motors.

[Jack Gifford]

I agree on the attractiveness of a '58. And don't forget that it's a forged crank with straight-shot oiling of the rod journals.

[Rocky 389]

I agree regarding bore/stroke/rod length ratio. 58 Pontiacs ruled their class in drag racing for years. I was impressed enough to build one {OK, mine's a 347 punched .125"} for my 34 ford coupe.....muncie 4 speed and Winters quick change....cant' WAIT to drive it.

[Bzltyr]

I have a 347 in the garage but the block is too far gone.

I would be interested in a 370 block if anyone has one.

I am in Phoenix AZ.

[b-man]

I'm in need of pulleys, a dipstick and upper dipstick tube for my '59 389 if for any reason you might decide to part out your 389.

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by JD311

I thought all 59 blocks had the same casting number?

I'm digging for a piece of paper I have that had all the numbers of both blocks(saw it recently too)... I recall having a hard time verifying what the AN420 was as the only published casting # I could find was the one you have.(the one I still have as well.)
Everything on that AN motor was March or April casting/build dates including manifold and carbs. Vin stamp matched the 59 Catalina. If I'm not mistaken, I believe it was Tom S back in the very early "CP" days that told me for sure it was a 59 casting.

The 59 that didnt get away came with the Catalina when I bought it. I almost passed on it because it was deep in the ground with the pan rotted badly... I threw it on the trailer only because the guy was going to scrap it if I didnt take it.

Turned out to be quite a neat piece. The original owner of this stuff had died in a car wreck on New Years day 63. Car eventually went from familys garage to field behind the barn.
Several months after having the motor sitting in my barn I noticed the ports on the heads were heavily taped up. So I dragged it over to my workshop area with better light and decided to pull the tape. Ports were nice and shiny with plenty of evidence of a port/polish job. Pulled the crusty stock valve covers and found the mice had quite a hotel built. All rockers had been backed off(lock nuts over regular nuts). some light rust here and there on generally shiny light weight pushrods.
I had to pull the heads(which were 1960 heads fitted with the 55-59 gusher tubes)...I found immaculate bores/chambers, stock valve sizes, along with a coat of dried up oil(waxy) on cyl walls. Had victor head gaskets on it. Oil passages to heads were blocked of with set screws. Pistons were domed and highly polished with NO valve notches...this was getting real interesting.

I pulled the lifters and found they were solid edge orifice type. Pulled the timing cover and and steel geared timing set and found I had the old Isky E2 grind Pontiac cam in it. Balancer was the early SD type but badly deteriorated from the weather . Flywheel was a Harvey Aluminum piece. Sadly galvanic corrosion had set in and when I started removing clutch bolts I tore chunks out instead. Clutch face and flywheel had no signs of wear.
In process of removing flywheel the crank started to rotate. Off came the oil pan and a half hour of cleaning out the mice's grand ball room...I find the oil pickup brazed to pump and dip stick tube brazed to windage tray. After wiping lower exposed bores I find they arent rusted, just a dirty waxy film(old oil?). I spray a bunch of 50/50 marvel mystery oil/WD40 on cylinder walls (upper and lower) loosen all caps I could and spray the mix around the edges and rotate motor till I could loosen all the rod caps. I pull the pistons and rods out and find early SD rods and JE on underside of pistons.
There are NO signs the motor had ever been run. No carbon found anywhere. The main and rod bearings are darker grey than new but no scratches. Cylinder bores are fresh crosshatch a few with light stains where the rings sat. Bore is at @4.12
(The AN had same pistons but 4.21 bore and domes not polished on standard rods and Engle hyd cam)

The armasteel crank is very nicely detailed and counterweights smoothed and rounded nicely. considerable detail at oil holes(straight shot oiling btw), and one of the balancing holes is filled with braze.
The block has been well detailed, especially the oil passages, especially in the main bearing intersections.
The outside of the block had very little rust and has some original paint under a slightly lighter shade. Water jackets are just hazed with rust, no crust to be seen.

The 59 distributor had a dual point conversion in it(SD perhaps?), the car had an old SD tach. The AN motor also had original long branches on it. The Cat had a homemade heavy steel clutch sheild welded to the frame. Car had been converted to floor shift and came with a 3 speed with staight cut gears. Odometer was a bit over 31k. Found the car outside of Fulton NY.

Calvin Hills Dads car came new with same options and color scheme(inside and out) and similar build dates. Unfortunately mine had sat in a field too long and needed more love than I could give it... despite sitting thru decades of upstate NY winters the chrome and especially stainless were very nice. At one point I wanted to build it as it was then evolve it a few years later.
Someone built a fairly serious motor for back in the day!(possibly early 60's superstock or modified production? Stock class cheater?)

The ported 1960 heads(w/gusher tubes) and 58 timing cover have gone to Atlanta for use on a 301T block build. The tripower and 1959 "x" heads, E2 cam and lifters pushrods were sold. The AN block was last known to be in Ohio. I kick myself for selling the long branches. Still have the polished 4.12" domed JE pistons with pins and rulon pin buttons.(pay the freight and they can be yours)

[mechanickeith]

Originally Posted by Bzltyr

I have a 347 in the garage but the block is too far gone.

I would be interested in a 370 block if anyone has one.

I am in Phoenix AZ.

Steve Barcak has a couple for sale.

[Bzltyr]

I e-mailed him a while ago and got no response.

We met down on central one night. I have a 61 tempest as well. I need a transaxle for it.

Thanks,

Brad

[mechanickeith]

Try again,, he's real busy right now.

[Steve Barcak]

Originally Posted by mechanickeith

Steve Barcak has a couple for sale.

I have an extra nice 370 available. It is std bore, has been vatted and mag'd already. Crank and rods in same condition

steve@pontiacheaven.org

ph 480-899-7873 not into texting

[Bzltyr]

Thanks for the reply.

I am almost positive my 347 crank will work.
Am I wrong?

[Jack Gifford]

347 and 370 cranks are dimensionally identical. My experience is that some 347 cranks are cast, but I've never seen a 370 that wasn't forged.

[b-man]

.....for storage. I separated the engine from the trans by unbolting the aluminum trans bell from the iron bell housing attached to the block.

Raising the engine with my hoist was the easiest way to accomplish this, after pulling the trans back just enough to disengage the six torus studs from the flexplate.



I set the 389 on an engine dolly that I made from the bottom tray of a discarded shop cart and some tubing scraps.



Now safely parked behind my freshly built '64 421 HO.





I hoisted the trans back into the bed of my truck for now, I'm not sure what I'll be doing with it just yet.

[Bzltyr]

Originally Posted by Jack Gifford

347 and 370 cranks are dimensionally identical. My experience is that some 347 cranks are cast, but I've never seen a 370 that wasn't forged.

Thanks for the info. I will check my 347 crank.

[BruceWilkie]

Glad you got it off Bart... I forgot to tell you flexplate comes out before bell(easiest).Cant do that with trans still on bell.

fwiw my 59 had a hydramatic bell over the aluminum flywheel/clutch that was on it. Maybe it was going to be a hydro stick setup???

[tom s]

Jack is right,when Kaase was doing his his EMC pontiac engine I gave him the info on the forged 57-58 cranks.The first one he found ended up be a cast one and had to go find another which was a forged unit.Tom