[trishieldchief]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Pat Brown had a Lucy Blue 1972 455HO 4spd GTO with X in VIN and it didn't list the engine option on Invoice. That has been the only one i had ever heard of ... so far.
Was yours the same Lucy Blue car - sold new in Columbus Ohio ?

The dealer apparently didn't get charged , but the buyer probably did

Here you go Baron.
This was a 72 455 HO 4 speed GTO I once owned true X in VIN 455 HO car ,note VIN on PHS shows X in Vin .
Customer was billed for mandatory Unit Ignition and Air Inlet HD both mandatory options on a 455 HO car but as you can see was not invoiced for 455 HO engine upgrade.
So here is proof of inaccurate PHS docs.
See attached pic

[Judge273]

Wow both early cars in 72. Same color and both 4 speeds. Dealer probably changed the real costs quoted as stated by BVZ.

But, what a coincidence and no real excuse...

Still got dinged for the little edge guard stuff but, dealer pocketed 236 or so.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Thanks for sharing that one with us TriShield !
Wonder how many more early 72 GTO's out there got the free 455HO upgrade .
A glitch like this - probably more than these 2 .

Retail 455HO on GTO was 134.00 / Dealer Net 104.52

I will check across the math on these later tonight and see if maybe the money is in the total somehow - or not .
Very Wild

[Rocky Rotella]

As Baron noted, it could unseemingly be built into the cost, but I've been told in the past that Pontiac distributed settlement invoices to recoup costs of major options that may have inadvertently went un-invoiced. What PHS has may not be a vehicle's final invoice, only the one that was saved. I highly doubt Pontiac gave too many options away!

[johnta1]

I wonder if we can ask Ram Air I about this?

Maybe he has some insight into this?
(he seems to have a lot of dealership paperwork still)

His collection of Judges and 69 TA paperwork:

Hardin Motors

[thepontiacman]

Make sure when filling out form for PHS that you write in the VIN below the boxes where you typed it in. If it is faxed in ,sometimes VIN number will look distorted. This way they have back up to compare if there is a question on a number or letter.

Verify VIN

I once sent in VIN for a two-tone 69 GTO and with one number being distorted, the PHS was for the wrong car. It was for another two-tone 69 with different colors and a auto. instead of 4spd.
I let them know about the correct VIN on the form and they ran the correct VIN and everything was right.

There are a lot of things that were done back when these cars were built that we will never understand. If a human did it,there is chance for errors.

PHS is the source for factory documentation.

If you are lucky enough to find build sheets or other documents still with the car, that is very helpful.

[Ram Air I]

I don't have much to add that hasn't been said. I do remember that it was not unusual to swap things between new cars on the lot. Radios and wheels/tires were the most common. Any item that was relatively easy to remove was fair game though. Whatever was necessary to make the sale was done. Also, the customer sometimes came back at a later date and visited the parts dept. to get options or accessories to add that doesn't show up on the invoice.
The invoices we get from PHS are of course what Pontiac used to bill the dealer for the car. I would assume they were extremely cautious about mistakes since it could cost Pontiac $$. But there were errors. Plus dont forget the assembly workers who occasionally made mistakes (or intentionally) as well by adding incorrect parts or failing to add something.

[tripower]

Maybe the question to ask is if anyone has seen a 72 X code car with the 34X (455HO) sales group listed on their PHS. Would be interesting to see how it was priced into the car. In the PHS Rich posted, it looks to be standard Lemans HT coupe pricing.

If we don't have any PHS where 34X is broken out, perhaps it was encompassed as part of the VIN?

[The Boss]

Not a GTO but it is a convertible.

The second one was my WW5 equipped GTO hardtop where it all got bundled in.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

i haven't taken the time to do the math on those invoices yet
But later tonight i will. i really will. lol

But i do have other invoices beginning in November 71 and upwards for 72 GTO X 455HO cars and all those have the 34X and 134.00 price tag.

It may be there was a schematic early in the year that picked up and included the cost in the invoice totals. Which would have been incorrect/error in the standard format procedure.

Or could more likely be , there was no schematic in place to draw out and call out and charge for the 455HO and it went un-noticed for a couple/few months. More early invoices would be great to see and compare.

If it was this latter explanation - it got caught at least by November - and PMD would have back-audited these previous cars.
What resulted from that point, can only guess.
Perhaps not enough cars involved to do the hassles and battles and paperworks with the dealers.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Ran the numbers on both invoices.
The $134.00 engine option cost is NOT in the totals.

The engines were "free" - to put it loosely .

[Judge273]

Actually part of the engine was free.

You got a 400 as base in GTO option, and upgrade to 455ho was the 134.00.

[Judge273]

Originally Posted by YNOBIL

Keep in mind "PHS" deals with the factory invoice and I believe that to be the Gospel. My friend Bob special ordered the near twin to my '72 GTO but he didn't know that in '72 white letter tires became an option. When the car arrived with black walls and Bob protested. The dealer (Community Pontiac) just swapped tires and rims with a '71 GTO they had on the lot. So your "old man" may have taken delivery with black walls but who's to say the dealer didn't do a swap before he made the purchase.

Here is that example:



Here is phs too:

[YNOBIL]

Mike, Thanks for posting Bob's paperwork.

[YNOBIL]

Originally Posted by Judge273

Here is that example:

I looked at Bob's window sticker plenty of times and never noticed the stupid dealer wrote on the bottom of it. They added a $65 charge, at first I thought it was for the White Letter tires. I think "ECP" was the dealer undercoating which I know you spent a lot of time removing.

[ml3126]

PHS was correct. Car is home from painting and painter confirmed it was gold and the holes in firewall for ram air and clutch.

[The Boss]

Congratulations!

[PB]

Cool...I just stumbled upon this thread today. I have seen one other 455-HO PHS delete with a lower VIN than 3122 for sale on Ebay some time ago. Not sure if it was the same one as Rich's though. Pretty sure it's in a thread in here somewhere.......I recall mentioning it in the past on a thread. Where's HFR when you need him?

[UPC-WU2]

Originally Posted by ml3126

PHS was correct. Car is home from painting and painter confirmed it was gold and the holes in firewall for ram air and clutch.

Congratulations. So did the car get painted Granada Gold?

[ml3126]

It did not. Received the PHS too late.