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#1
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Positive connection under hood
With the battery in the trunk?
What are you guys doing to hook up a timing light , or get 12V to test equipment, Thinking someone may have a more creative solution than my idea of using long booster cables laying on the ground to bring battery connections to the front on the car. Anyone use the + feed on the alternator or is that a bad idea? Sorry if these are amateur questions.
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73 T/A 455, 4speed |
#2
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How do you have your trunk mounted battery connected to your starter? Something like the below power distribution block can be used.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-900182 Run power from the battery + cable at your starter to the power block mounted wherever you need it. You can grab power for your test equipment there.
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-Jason 1969 Pontiac Firebird |
The Following User Says Thank You to JLMounce For This Useful Post: | ||
#3
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Once I accidentally got the power cable to my timing light cut by the fan I started to use the main hot on the back of the Alt.
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Wernher Von Braun warned before his retirement from NASA back in 1972, that the next world war would be against the ETs! And he was not talking about 1/8 or 1/4 mile ETs! 1) 1940s 100% silver 4 cup tea server set. Two dry rotted 14 x 10 Micky Thompson slicks. 1) un-mailed in gift coupon from a 1972 box of corn flakes. Two pairs of brown leather flip flops, never seen more then 2 mph. Education is what your left with once you forget things! |
#4
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My firebird has a power stud location at the passenger side radiator support. But I could also pick up power at the Ford Solenoid
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#5
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probably should add a ford style starter solenoid in the engine bay. thats where i hook my light to and it will help your starter and give you a distribuion point for other voltage requirements
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1969 carousel red firebird 455, richmond 5 speed 1964 540 gto 1971 lemans sport convertible 1972 Maverick under slow construction |
The Following User Says Thank You to mysticmissle For This Useful Post: | ||
#6
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B+ feed on the alternator for me.
K
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'63 LeMans Convertible '63 Grand Prix '65 GTO - original, unrestored, Dad was original owner, 5000 original mile Royal Pontiac factory racer '74 Chevelle - original owner, 9.85 @ 136 mph besthttp://www.superchevy.com/features/s...hevy-chevelle/ My Pontiac Story: http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=560524 "Intro from an old Assembly Plant Guy":http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=342926 |
The Following User Says Thank You to Keith Seymore For This Useful Post: | ||
#7
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This. I have a timing light that runs off 2 D batteries but the Ford style solenoid is a good idea for several reasons as mentioned.
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69 Bird w/1970 400 block(409 cubes), #64 heads, hyd. roller, Q-jet by Jeff E., original interior, ps, pdb, th350, and 3.73 gears. Pump gas, street driven muscle. 3800 lbs. race weight. Best, 11.39 @118, my son's car. 79 T/A w/463, Scat crank, Eagle rods, Icon pistons, Lunati solid roller, 262/270, KRE 325 heads, Northwind intake, QF950 carb, full interior, ps, pdb, th350, and 3.73 gears. Pump gas, 3650 lbs. race weight. 10.68 @ 126 so far... no tuning yet. |
The Following User Says Thank You to prostreet64 For This Useful Post: | ||
#8
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If you have a Ford solenoid on the fender like you should, right there grab it right on the Ford Solenoid.
AND your solenoid on the starter itself will last forever. |
The Following User Says Thank You to Dragncar For This Useful Post: | ||
#9
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I normally use a battery starter pack to power the timing light.
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#10
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Quote:
I do like them when used with the older-design, direct drive electromagnet starters. The "Ford solenoid" on the fender doesn't change the way the solenoid on the starter works, it just supplies more voltage to it. They'll still wear, and they'll still burn the copper disc and contacts inside the solenoid. |
The Following User Says Thank You to Schurkey For This Useful Post: | ||
#11
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Thanks guys, I think both the Ford solenoid and power post are great ideas and I will pick one or the other as a future small project.
I also appreciate the two proven quick solutions of a portable battery pack or the main + on the back of the alternator as I’d like to check the timing and adjust the carb with a tack under the hood.
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73 T/A 455, 4speed |
#12
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Here's what I did:
Mounted the Ford starter relay on the firewall, near to where the necessary circuit wiring is for convenience. The plexi box is to prevent a problem if a wrench or something falls off the cowling onto the battery connections.
George
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"...out to my ol'55, I pulled away slowly, feeling so holy, god knows i was feeling alive"....written by Tom Wait from the Eagles' Live From The Forum |
#13
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Quote:
It might be milliseconds but the Ford switch gets it first, saves the one on the starter. The first high amp big draw does not take place on the starters solenoid, its already happened on the firewall. They work fine "as is" with a Summit/Denso gear reduction starter. I have had this setup since the 90s and it works flawlessly. Same ole starter drive. The starter does in fact disengage cleanly and does not grind my ring gear ever. I have never replaced one on a Pontiac from damage. And I am one of those guys who starts and shuts off his engine moving up in the lanes. I don.t want a hot engine by the time I get to the line. For whatever reason you seem to like to "correct" me a lot. Well, not only does the Ford deal work great, no damage. It does NOT supply more voltage, its the same. It supplies more potential current/amps to the starter itself. |
#14
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I've always used the alternator positive terminal and run the timing cable through the hood spring so not to have the cable cut the fan blade.
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- Mike '69 Firebird 400 - Goldenrod Yellow, 455 +.060, '6s-7' heads, Comp Cam 276AH-10 (51-309-4), TH400, Ford 9-inch w/3.08, 800cfm Q-jet, Stock Intake, Hooker Headers, Flowmasters '68 Coronet 500 Convertible - Medium Gold Metallic, stock 318 +100,000 miles |
The Following User Says Thank You to Hikin Mike For This Useful Post: | ||
#15
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Another back of alternator
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'78 Macho T/A DKM#95, 460cid, SRP pistons, KRE 310 D ports, 3" pypes, Hooker 1 3/4" headers, hydraulic roller, 10" Continental, 3.42 gears 11.5 @117.5mph 3900lbs ([_|_] ##\|/##[_|_]) |
#16
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Alternator
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LIFT HEAVY, LIFE IS TOO SHORT TO BE SMALL! |
#17
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Quote:
Quote:
Aside from adding a minuscule amount of resistance which theoretically might soften the "high amperage hit", there's very little current flow (amperage) through the Ford solenoid contacts until the starter solenoid high-amperage contacts close. The starter solenoid is seeing exactly the same conditions as it did before (with one exception, later.) The starter solenoid is still engaging with battery voltage on one copper contact, the disc bridges the gap to the second (motor) contact, which is essentially a dead-short since the motor isn't turning yet. Battery voltage into a dead short is going to be (for an instant) a high-amperage hit, just like it would be without the Ford solenoid on the fender. The contacts on the Ford solenoid are already closed before the high-amperage starter draw flows through them, while the starter solenoid closes "live", power on one contact, ground on the other. The only current flowing through the Ford solenoid contacts as they close, would be the low-amperage of the starter solenoid windings. Only after the starter solenoid builds magnetism, pulling the plunger, and snapping the copper disc into contact with it's mating copper lugs, does the full starter motor current flow though the Ford solenoid contacts. What does the Ford solenoid do? The wiring layout with the Ford solenoid provides a higher-voltage, increased amperage power supply to the starter solenoid WINDINGS, usually eliminating the "failure to crank when hot" problem with the old Delco direct-drive starter motors. The vehicle wire harness, in particular the circuit connected to the "S" terminal of the starter solenoid via the purple wire becomes frail (high resistance, corroded wires, poor connections) which means the solenoid windings get poor power and therefore a weakened magnetic pull on the starter motor plunger. Since the purple wire is no longer connected to the starter solenoid, a short, high-capacity copper link connects the heavy battery cable to the "S" terminal, assuring that the solenoid windings have all the power they can handle. I've seen those links as a solid piece of copper barstock, and also as a very short copper multistrand wire. Either way, internal resistance of that link is as close to zero as my equipment can measure. As a side benefit, the heavy battery cable connected to the starter solenoid is no longer electrically "hot" 24/7/365, somewhat reducing the chances of short-circuiting due to insulation failure, and setting the car on fire. So, if there's a reason for the Ford solenoid helping to preserve the starter solenoid, it would be because the improved power via the short link to the "S" terminal causes the solenoid to engage more quickly, more forcefully. I suppose this could improve the service life of the copper disc and the contacts...but I think we're back to theoretical improvement not "real" improvements. Quote:
So...I guess...it depends on the PMGR starter being used with the Ford solenoid. I thought the failure to release cleanly was universal with PMGR starters, and apparently I was wrong. Not that I'd noticed. At least, not you in particular. But if you say so... As said, compared to failing OEM wiring/connections, the wiring system used with the Ford solenoid can supply more voltage/amperage (power) to the starter solenoid windings via the very short copper link from main battery cable terminal to the solenoid "S" terminal. Because inserting the Ford solenoid into the heavy battery cable will inevitably add some tiny amount of resistance, actual power delivered through the bigass battery cable to the starter solenoid would theoretically be reduced...but probably not enough to measure, let alone affect actual operation. Last edited by Schurkey; 02-18-2024 at 03:54 PM. |
#18
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Quote:
What he said I have used the Ford solenoid with a factory GM starter and with a mini starter and it has always worked great for me. Never had a problem with the starter not disengaging all the way as mentioned.
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Tim Corcoran Last edited by Tim Corcoran; 02-18-2024 at 03:59 PM. |
#19
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I personally do not favor connecting a large battery cable to the alternator output stud. The stud is relatively small mechanically. Just my opinion.
george
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"...out to my ol'55, I pulled away slowly, feeling so holy, god knows i was feeling alive"....written by Tom Wait from the Eagles' Live From The Forum |
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