[mlewisariz]

Was F41 the correct designation for T/A ? Or,was that the Formula code and the asterisk on my sheet means a change from T/A spec.

[SS-TA]

My 73 with the 7/8" rear bar was a 07A build without radial tires.

[Formulabruce]

Originally Posted by keith k

Hi Bruce,
In '70, no Camaros (Z28, F41, etc.) had bars as big as those spec'd for the Trans Am -- front or rear. The Z28 rear bar, for example, was 11/16"... only 1/16" larger than the Formula bar, and much smaller than the 7/8" spec T/A bar.

Some info on '70 Camaro bars here:
http://nastyz28.com/threads/70-l78-f...estion.315513/

I hear you on the "misbuild" thing... that definitely happened occasionally back then. But no way were they misbuilding 60+% of anything. If misbuild was the answer, there'd be a lot of '70 Formulas with the fat T/A bars on them. And I've never seen a single one of those...

F-41 shows up on Pontiac Firebird paperwork. So on Same assy line, F-41 means 2 different things? ( just seeking clarity here) .

[johnta1]

The asterix is used to show what came standard on the car I believe?

So if it had an asterix on a TA with F-41 option it would be 'standard' equipment.

It should not have an asterix if it was a Formula (and had F-41).

[Judge273]

Echos of Norwood....

[mlewisariz]

Inre johnta1 ,I don't think it is about standard for T/A. Also on my build sheet there are asterisks for AS1 std frt hrn,N10 dual exhaust,&U76 W/S antenna.There is no asterisk for L74 400RA,G80Posi,or HO5 3:73 axle as well as other standard T/A features.Some codes have an = icon next to them but some are standard features and others are upgrades from base model. (the F41 code also has an = icon).

[johnta1]

Look on your buildsheet at the lower right corner.
There is some wording explaining it I believe?

# - Body Shop
% - Trim Shop
* - Standard

Not sure what the double asterix is, possibly an upgrade?

[johnta1]

BTW, could you post a clear pic of your build sheet?
Most I have are not real clear. Probably from PY making them smaller to fit here. Possibly send it to me and I can post a link to it.

Anyway, in box 17 I think is the code for the stabilizer bar.
Most I have show just one code, which I imagine is for the front.
Not sure why they don't show the rear code.

Also on some I have that show the = by some options, they seem to be a required thing maybe? Like on one it has California emissions with an = by it. Along with the A51 (like said) because all 2nd Gen Firebirds had buckets.
(plus some others)

[Held for Ransom]

Originally Posted by mlewisariz

An additional note on my 06B Van Nuys. I checked my build sheet,and on the lower section it shows *F41 SPC PERF SUSP. I wonder if the asterick has any meaning in relation to available bar sizes or a missed cue for assembler.
I would think the proliferation of smaller bars might indicate a shortage of larger dia. parts in Van Nuys.

No, if you look at the legend in the lower RH of your build sheet, you'll see that the * means standard.

Oops, I should have read the second page before replying.

[keith k]

The build sheet observation is interesting, and got me digging through my files to look at that...

I have a couple copies of build sheets for 70 Van Nuys Formulas, and 7 build sheets for 70 Van Nuys T/As. Interestingly, both the Formulas and the T/As show "*F41 SPC PERF SUSP" in the typed content list at the bottom of the build sheet.

But in Box 17 (labeled "stab bar") of the pick code matrix up at the top, the Trans Ams show either code "FT40" or "FT--", and the Formulas show code "FW--".

Unfortunately, there's not a lot of overlap between the cars I have the build sheet images for, and the cars I have good pictures of the rear bars for. I have both for only 3. One is L1029XX which has the small rear bar and code FT--, one is L1086XX with small rear bar and code FT--, and the last one is L1105XX with code FT-- but with the large rear bar.

It would be interesting to know if there was some significance to the FT40 vs FT--. Did the "--" indicate the smaller rear bar that was shared with the Formula?

I have never seen a build sheet from a Norwood 70; and only a handful from Van Nuys (usually in crappy condition...).

[Formulabruce]

I had for a long time assumed in Sub assembly, they used those 'F" codes on the paper "Tags" on the bar itself to choose which went in that subframe. I also assume the rubbers had to on them as they were different sizes.
I think my '72 had a "FU" tag, which I thought correlated to the build sheet letter code.
This make sense? Maybe there was/is a F40, and F41 ? option code ?

[mlewisariz]

OK...Here goes my info. My build sheet is crappy but mostly legible albeit stained,torn, and taped together. Box 17 is FT--. There are no codes in box 107 w/%marking. The 5 codes marked * (horn,spec. susp.,dual exhaust,w/s antenna,and U35? -------clock) seem to be standard equip. No # coded parts. Some of the = items are trim pcs. (belt reveal mldg., console,)Some are driveline,(f41 susp,M21 trans,evap.ems ctrl) Others are body(o/s r/l mirrors, deck lid ext[spoiler?]. maybe the = covers both % and # notations.

In addition, from PHS material:1970 Pontiac spec equip. order form,Pg.4,2887 T/A,Handling package-heavier 1.25 front stabilizer and larger 7/8 rear stabilizer. Under 2687 Formula 400,Handling package-Front stabilizer(no dia.listed) and new 5/8 rear stabilizer bar. No date on this form.
On AMA spec. form,Pg. 21; 1970 Firebird, dated 2-5-1970:F/susp stabilizer .940Dia std,-1.125 dia. w/400 Eng.(b) b is EXC T/A.-1.25 dia.
Rear susp.-.620 dia. (c) c is Formula 400 only: .875 on T/A.
Also there is a F40 code for hd susp. on b-body and Tempest on the equip. order sheet but no F41 code anywhere

[Norwood]

Can anybody say for sure what the actual factory finish is on these bars ?

[Formulabruce]

Factory "non finish" is "Natural". The black paint the dealers had was specifically meant to paint the sides of stuff under the car that may or had some flash rust visible from the sides or rear.
If you see Black it was put on in final assembly in a hap hazard manner , or by the dealership at set up. As a set up green horn, I did this many times, and saw many of the older cars come back in as done the same way.
I like Bob Benet's Idea of using RPM ( ECS Automotive) .