[b_latour]

Hi,

I have been a member now for 6 months and this is my first post. I have previously been able to answer the majority of my questions just by reading old post but this time I do not see anything related to my problem.

My baby, Louise, is a 1966 GTO and she has a power steering belt issues. The power steering belt will not stop squealing under heavy load. The belt always stays tight, never rolls over, and appears properly aligned. After staring at the situation for several hours, I finally noticed that the crank pulley groove for the power steering belt looked too narrow. The belt was riding way too high in the groove (only about half of the belt was making contact with the pulley). I am running a 1/2 width belt (Gates 9540). The power steering pump pulley is obviously designed for a 1/2 width belt and the groove on the water pump pulley is also 1/2. A quick scan of the Restoration Guide confirmed that the power steering belt is indeed supposed to be 1/2 in width.

At this point, I just thought I had the wrong crank pulley. Knowing Louise’s previous owners fondness for junkyard parts this seemed logical. Therefore, I bought a used pulley that was billed as being from a 1966 GTO with PS and A/C (3-groove pulley). Well, I just got the crank pulley today in the mail and it looks just like the one I already have. The groove for the power steering belt is 3/8 width.

I now own two crank pulleys. Neither of which seems right. I do have the part numbers of the crank pulley I just purchased. As you might know, the pulley is in two pieces.

The front (two groove P/S and Alt) pulley: 9782680 (problem child)
The back (single groove, A/C) pulley: 9782704

The other pulley set is still on Louise and I cannot currently make out the numbers.

The restoration guide does list a part number but it appears to be for the whole 3 groove assemble.

So, to make a long story short, can anybody help?
I would like to know if the power steering belt is suppose to be 1/2 width, and if they are, what crank pulley do I need?
Or, please just correct me if I am totally confused.

Thanks,

B

[Rugratman]

Welcome to the boards.
If I could just step back for a minute, is the (gates) belt itself new?

I had a similar problem a few years ago, and the NAPA belt squeeled like a pig. It turned out that the belt itself was just a hair too wide. I got a different belt, no problems since. It was rubbing on the insides of the groove.

Flat belt or V belt?

[b_latour]

Thanks for the reply rugratman,

Yes the belt is new, just got it the other day. I also tried the 74XX series gates belt which is close to 3/8, it made even more noise.

[Rugratman]

Did the old belt squeel?
I would think if a V belt is too thin, it would not grab enough, and slip.

Maybe our host has a good belt?

[b_latour]

Rugratman,

Thank you for sticking with me on this......

Yes, the original belt also squealed. In fact, on the drive home from buying the car a year ago the belt made noise. This has been an ongoing issue for me. I have tried Gates belts and Dayco belts to no avail. I have not tried our sponsor’s belts.

I guess I have been focusing on the crank pulley because the groove for the power steering belt looks wrong. Just comparing the grooves by eye on can tell that the A/C groove is obviously wider then the P/S groove. And as far as I can tell they are suppose to use the same width belt.

[Rugratman]

If I had too, I would swear my two belts...Alt, PS are the same width.
But, I am running aftermarket pulley's. My grooves look to be the exact same width.

Are you running flat belts or V belts? Maybe the V belt is bottoming out on the bottom of the pulley? And I guess double check the alignment again. It doesn't take much for the sides to rub and then squeel.
On my PS pump, I have to put a washer behind the bracket(bottom) to kick mine out a bit.

[4bl389]

It seems like you have a P/S pulley problem according to the guide P/S pulley should be Part # 9782671 with A/C for 66 I have a couple of these and it looks like it's for a 3/8's belt it's a narrow groove what's the part # on your P/S pulley Steve.

[ftwmlp]

I had similar issues on my 66. Bought new belts from Ames Perf to correct problem.

[b_latour]

All,

Thank you for the replies.

The Gates belt I am running is a V belt. It does not appear to bottom out on the crank pulley; it is more like it is just too wide and hits the side of the groove.

That’s an interesting theory about the power steering pulley. I must admit, I did not think about it from that side. I just went and checked and my pulley has the same part number as you mentioned 9782671. The 1/2 width belt fits pretty well in it. I could see putting a 3/8 belt through it though, it might ride below the edge of the pulley, but could work. That would mean, of course, that I have the wrong water pump pulley. The groove for the power steering on the water pump pulley is noticeably wider than the groove for the alternator. There is one thing wrong; what about the Restoration Guide and the Repair Manual? They both list the power steering belt as being 1/2 in width and the Alternator as being 3/8 width. I guess they could be wrong.

I just checked our host and Ames online catalog, and, while they both have a listing for the belt, they do not specify the width of the belt. Rock Auto shows the power steering and alternator belts as both being 3/8 in width.
Hmmmmm.

I just checked the water pump pulley, and it has a number of 481040 XT. The Restore guide shows a different number.

Could it simply be that I just have the wrong water pump pulley? Can anybody confirm that the stock Alternator and Power steering pump use the same width belts?

Thanks

[ctgross]

My 66 stock alt. and p/steer. belts ARE the same width. The p/steer belt is a Gates 11A13545. If you want, I'll crank it over so I can read the number on the alt. belt.

[Rugratman]

I checked last night. Mine are also the same width.

[merlotgoat]

Mine are different--late '67 with original pulleys. Could it have varied depending on production date?

[4bl389]

Just pulled out my waterpump pulley #9782679 for P/S and A/C has the same narrow grooves as alt and P/S hope this helps Steve

[quicksilver97ta]

While you have the belt off give that p.s. pulley a spin to make sure it spins freely.

[b_latour]

Wow,

Thank you all for going out of your ways to help me.

I think we are on to something. It is my guess the repair manual and the restore guide are both wrong about the width of the P/S belt for a 66 GTO with P/S and A/C. I also believe my problem all along was the water pump pulley. It appears my goat’s previous owner bolted on something he got from the junkyard. The water pump pulley I have has some strange numbers on it. The pulley also has two different size grooves, one 3/8” for the alternator and one 1/2” for the Power Steering. As 4BL389 was so kind to confirm, pulley 9782679, which my car should be using, has two grooves the same size.


You know, I think rugratman said it best, when baffled, spending money and getting nowhere, “Stand back for a minute”.

The Repair manual, the Restore Guide, the ½ belt that came with car and the ½ groove in the water pump pulley all made me think that the crank pulley was wrong since it had a 3/8 width groove. I should have noticed that a 3/8 belt fits well in the P/S pump pulley. I guess I learned a lesson--do not always believe what you read, and do not be afraid to ask for help every once in a while.


On another note, today I bought a 9782679 Water Pump Pulley on EBay for $10.00 plus shipping from Oak Hill A/P in Petersberg, VA. I hope to have it in a couple days. I also plan to order some belts from our sponsor, if for anything, just out of appreciation for this bulletin board.


Quicksilver97ta, I will be sure to check the P/S pump turns freely, thanks for the tip.
Ctgross and Rugratman thanks for the confirmation on the belt widths and I hope Merlotgoat is right about the width changing in 67.

I will let you know how the pulley works out.

Thanks again.

[Rugratman]

Quick has a point also, if that pulley on the PS is binding up in any way, it will create drag, then it might squeel also.

B Latour, let's hope this is the fix, at least it's cheap enough.
Now how about a pic?

[ftwmlp]

The 1996 Pontiac Chassis Shop Manual (CD version) says the Power Steering Belt is 15/32 " Width and the Water Pump Belt is 3/8" Ames sells a 1/2 for the Power Steering and 3/8 for the Water Pump. My problem was an incorrect PS pulley, they are different diameters depending on whether the car is PS & AC.

[lust4speed]

I've seen (and owned) mismatched belts and pulleys. A new belt should not make noise whether it is mismatched or not. A half inch wide new premium belt in a pulley made for 3/8" is going to look bad and will eventually have a wear problem, but it shouldn't make noise. I'd be suspecting that your power steering pump is creating too much of a drag on the system. If it squeals a new belt on a pulley one size off, it will wear out a belt even if the pulleys are correct for the belt.

On both my 67's (no 66's to check, one air car and one without), they have the different sized widths for PS and Alt. Most of the cars I've seen at shows are running the wrong belts, but they don't make noise driving into or leaving the show. I have run mismatched sets while trying different diameters of pulleys to see which work best for cooling.

The top line NAPA belts are made by Gates and I've found no better belts. I've thrown or twisted lesser belts at the drags, but the premium line is great. I don't want to be the one to have you over tighten your belts, but they do take a pretty fair preload to perform properly.

[b_latour]

All,

I thought I would let everyone know that my power steering belt is no longer squealing. It appears the issue was I had the wrong water pump pulley. I replaced my old water pump pulley last night with a stock one and installed a new 3/8 width belt and now everything working great.


Thanks again for all the tips and help.

[ctgross]

Good job. Sometimes these old machines just want to kick our butts don't they...just have to back away on occasion and start with the basics.