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THE LOBBY A gathering place. Introductions, sports, showin' off your ride, birthday-anniversary-milestone, achievements, family oriented humor. |
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#21
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Thank you to all that have served.
I havent watched it yet,but have been downloading them to watch later. My father in law was there in 64-66, he would rarely talk about it, when he did it was with other vets from the VVA. My wifes uncle just recently passed away and we have been tasked with cleaning out his house. In doing so we have found letters that her dad sent her uncle, and parents. To read the letters to his brothers, he talked about the way things were, and about what was happening. Some were very descriptive. The letters to his parents were very plain. He also sent some pictures that he had taken while there. |
#22
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Insisting we should have just invaded or used heavier artillery and fought the commies where they stood in their homes is simplifying it considerably. Complaining about "hurt feelings" when you're killing hundreds of thousands of people?
That said, the majority of the problems we've seen since WWII on the era of Vietnam, the middle east, etc are all the results of the previous century's European imperialist policies that we ended up getting dragged into by countries who had no clue what they were doing besides exploiting resources and the native populations. Not that isolationism would have been a viable alternative, but the entire world situation is considerably more complicated and delicate than the majority of the population would like to believe... |
#23
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Don't forget the rules about politics in the lobby....no reason to get a civil discussion locked.
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#24
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No, the Chinese and Vietnamese have gone to war numerous times over the last 2,000 years. I guess you don't recall the 1979 invasion of Vietnam by the PRC? The Vietnamese sent the PRC packing back over the border with their tails between their legs. The Soviets actually considered going to war with the PRC because they were "requisitioning" nearly half of the combat supplies they (the Soviets) were sending to North Vietnam through China.
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It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance. Dr. Thomas Sowell |
#25
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Stuart, I agree. Hopefully we all can keep the thread "clean enough"
FYI, the series isn't on tonight or tomorrow evening. I starts again Sunday afternoon at 1:00, I believe, replaying episodes 1-4, then showing episode 5 at. 7:00 PM. There's so much potential negativity that could have been posted here, thank thankfully has not... Is it perfect, well of course not. Does it tell us a LOT of behind scenes stuff, yes. I'd like folks to post their opinion of the series. I was born in 58 so I was way too young. One of my Dad's employee's at his Skelly gas station( in Eastern Iowa) was a chopper pilot, shot down and left for dead Twice by the enemy....he was never the same. He took his life in 1979. One of my fellow Pontiac heads was a medic, for one year., in the army .The car manufacturers had programs that allowed you to order you car of choice, while serving. When you got back, they would fly you directly to the assembly plant to pick up your new car. He ordered a 69 firebird, 400 RA III (didn't think he could afford the RA IV), TH400, PS, PB, no AC (lived in Iowa, and this thing was going to get raced), front disc brakes. Well they couldn't get his car done for him to pick it up on arrival. He kept after them, they finally got it done. I think the hold up may have been because he ordered it with a column shift automatic and a front bench seat...anyone ever see a 1st gen firebird with a front bench seat?
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1977 Black Trans Am 180 HP Auto, essentially base model T/A. I'm the original owner, purchased May 7, 1977. Shut it off Shut it off Buddy, I just shut your Prius down... Last edited by 77 TRASHCAN; 09-22-2017 at 08:25 PM. |
#26
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nonsense.
"China’s indirect role in Vietnam was even more massive and critical. It is now known that in a secret meeting between Ho Chi Minh and Mao in the summer of 1965, China agreed to enter the war directly if the United States invaded North Vietnam. As it was, China’s indirect involvement in Vietnam was its greatest military effort after the Korean War. According to Beijing, between 1965 and 1973, there were 320,000 Chinese troops assigned to North Vietnam, with a maximum of 170,000 – roughly a third of the maximum number of U.S. forces – in the south at their peak. On Sept. 23, 1968, Mao asked North Vietnamese premier Pham Van Dong, “Why have the Americans not made a fuss about the fact that more than 100,000 Chinese troops help you building railways, roads and airports although they know about it?” https://www.legion.org/magazine/2132...nt-war-vietnam |
#27
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Quote:
Here are some numbers: Quote:
BTW I was one of the " 2,709,918 Americans served in Vietnam, this number represents 9.7% of their generation. " FAC, 19th TASS, Vung Tau & Quan Loi 70-71. I sincerely doubt the FAC/CAS mission will be covered by the Ken Burns documentary. It was quite interesting ... Ogre
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Man will ultimately be governed by God or by tyrants. -- Benjamin Franklin - (1706-1790) US Founding Father |
#28
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Quote:
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It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance. Dr. Thomas Sowell |
#29
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Probably not, Pat, but you have every reason to be proud of your service in the Republic of Vietnam. If I haven't said it before....Thank you!
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It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance. Dr. Thomas Sowell |
#30
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Thanks Steve. It was a job like my many others later.
But it was the only job I ever held that I felt my hands were tied. I'm sure a lot of others felt the same way. My gratitude to all who served, and my sincere, heartfelt thanks to all who made the supreme sacrifice. In retrospect, I probably had more freedom to conduct my mission than a lot of others. Ogre
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Man will ultimately be governed by God or by tyrants. -- Benjamin Franklin - (1706-1790) US Founding Father |
#31
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Caught that myself.
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"Democracy is a beautiful thing, except for that part about letting just any old yokel vote." ~Jack Handey, Deep Thoughts |
#32
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The second fact you conveniently ignore is we had no great desire to be in VN to begin with, and widening the war for such vaporous gains we had no stomach for. An invasion of NVN would have been political suicide and would have caused another magnitude level of civil unrest. If widening the war was such a great idea - why did Nixon draw forces down? |
#33
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Great Series.
I lost 7 classmates from class of '65 in Vietnam, three were close friends. The war is still costing us good men! In the past 5 years, two more took their own lives. The last one was about two years ago. I knew he was Army and had been wounded over there. After the loss, I spoke with his brother and found out he was an Army Corpsman and had been wounded 6 times in Vietnam. We sure don't need another Korean War! |
#34
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__________________
It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance. Dr. Thomas Sowell |
#35
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As to the "minorities were cannon fodder" meme, I quit watching as soon as Burns repeated that lie. Minorities were 12.4% of the KIAs, almost exactly their participation rate. Burns is an historian, and they seem to be invariably leftists, with the exception of Victor Davis Hanson. Interesting quote: "Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of liberty. Pat, I know you know who said it, but the youngsters here probably don't.
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"Democracy is a beautiful thing, except for that part about letting just any old yokel vote." ~Jack Handey, Deep Thoughts |
#36
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1966 to 1967 C 2/34 Armor.. M48A3 52 tons of romping stomping death.
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"I think we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious." --Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Ludlow, 1824 |
#37
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John Wallace - johnta1 Pontiac Power RULES !!! www.wallaceracing.com Winner of Top Class at Pontiac Nationals, 2004 Cordova Winner of Quick 16 At Ames 2004 Pontiac Tripower Nats KRE's MR-1 - 1st 5 second Pontiac block ever! "Every man has a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts." "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid." Socrates |
#38
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Yes Bob, very eloquent was JFK's inaugural address, but I still have to fault him, and his number one "whiz kid". While McNamara may have been a whiz at business functions, he knew little about deploying the military, and I seriously doubt he fully understood the Southeast Asia geopolitical situation and history. When I first began (as a lowly zoomie in '64) receiving intel briefings on the "conflict", I still had a lot of doubts about what was to be accomplished except to stop the "domino theory" of Communist expansion. After four years it finally sunk in that was to be our mission. Seems a better defined military objective might have been crafted. Ogre
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Man will ultimately be governed by God or by tyrants. -- Benjamin Franklin - (1706-1790) US Founding Father |
#39
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Your contention was that an invasion of the North would have won the war - as stated before the administration knew this would bring China into the war and said as much, so it was off the table. If you believe China would not you are just fooling yourself.
You noted the human wave attacks by the Chinese in Korea - do you not think they would have done the same in NVN where they would have been that much more effective? And note the quality of fight the VC/NVA put up in the South - imagine the ferocity they would put up on their home turf; they would have NEVER given up. |
#40
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Here's an interesting link . This info is available on dod & va sights and other sources but this link is easier . The ethniticity facts are easy to reference , although it shouldn't matter , as the blood was all red , it also shouldn't be miss represented . https://www.uswings.com/about-us-win...nam-war-facts/
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When I wore a younger man's clothes |
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