Wayne has always been top notch with me.

John Stolpa in Waterford

Not sure if you talked with John in the last couple of years but he has had some unfortunate structural issues with his shop. You Old's guys are fortunate to have him. It looks like he's made the decision to only work with the Oldsmobile faithful.

I use Cruisers Motorsports in Danbury, CT :
Address: 39 Federal Road, Danbury, CT 06810
Phone #: (203)744-8863
Website:https://cruisersmotorsports.com/
The owner is Bob Schmus. I have been going to his shop since 2009. He has built five engines for me as follows:
All Pontiacs engines
406 in a 1978 TA S/E
433 RA IV in a 1970 TA
461 in a 1978 TA S/E
461 in a 1970 GTO
496 in a 1973 TA has SD #16 heads.

One last engine will be built for a 1969 GTO. It will be a 461 with RA II heads.

Bob is a Pontiac guy, but builds Mopar, Chevy, Buick, Olds & Fords.

He owns a 1970 GTO, 1999 TA & 1979 10th Annv. TA

2X on Paul Spotts, all he does are Pontiacs, and for many years

What about Kauffman? I just saw the hemi engine he just built for the Gasser Bros, very impressive!

About a year ago David Butler told me that they dropped the LS stuff and only do Pontiacs now.

:hooray:

I would venture a guess that Butler figured they had more than enough business focusing on the Pontiac engine niche market and decided since there are more than plenty of shops doing LS stuff why go there.

I had a small engine mechanic rebuild the 455 HO in my Trans Am. It was worn out and had a bent rod which he replaced. He did it in his car port. That engine ran great for the 7 years I had that car; I put a lot of miles on it too. Its a matter of attention to detail.

Hey, thanks guys for all the tips on shops.................i dont want to pull this motor out again to be worked on, shop i used was in Green Lake Wi, told me a month, took 8 months............and still the same issues, motor runs great, just leaks oil, rear main or whatever...............getting up there in age and really dont want to go thru this again, this would be the 3rd time this motor has been redone...............im at the 3 strikes your out game...............looking for a complete motor that runs good and doesnt leak, i know im asking alot here............lol................the only reason i mentioned Butler is because they have the motors there already, well that is if they ever call you and say your on the list.

I talked to Paul Korner a few times on the phone, seems like a great guy.................just AZ is a long way from me....................im thinking something on the forum will pop up sooner or later for a decent motor..............bascially im looking for a top notch bottom end, i have the kre heads and tri power for the top end.

Thanks for the help, i appreciate it

Rich

Maybe there's some back story here we don't have. Has the engine always leaked after several rebuilds? Possibly some machining issue as a result? You're going to have to pull and replace the engine anyhow. If it runs great, but leaks oil and that's not attributed to some sort of machining issue, why not yank it out, seal it back up and put it back in the car?

I had to pull my engine this spring due to a bonehead move by an exhaust shop. Like your case, my engine ran well but leaked a good amount of oil. While it was out it got a new pan, 1 piece gasket, verified a dry front and rear main etc. Now the engine is leak free.

Something to consider anyway.

I've heard really good things about Paul C in Tucson, but I know he's pretty swamped right now. Torqhead from the board recently had some work done and could only get some machining done in a pinch. In fact, as I looked around while my engine was out, it seems most everyone is a year or more out.

I am sure that David Butler working with Tony Bischoff on the latest Pontiac Cylinder Head designs and and David and Rodney supplying the bottom end parts, they are quite busy in Tennessee.

First time I have looked at their website in 6 years.

David, Rodney, and Jim (along with Mrs Butler) have made that quite a business.

Tom V.

Hey Jason, good to hear from you...............i think you hit it on the head im thinking something has not been right since the first rebuild in 2007.............motor ran great, but seemed to burn oil /leak...............rebuild in 2010............motor ran great, but same issue............this time in 2023 i had the motor re-ringed, that stopped the oil burning, motor runs great, but still have the leaks..................i do have the one pc bop rear main seal, the shop did a smoke test, says no issues....................well that isnt excately true..........lol............im wondering when he said he did a smoke test, if that wasnt the wacky tobaccy test...........

Im doing some testing on the leakage, and gonna post on that to see if its even worth messing around with it...............but since 2007 i always have had some oil in the inspection cover, but never a drop in the garage, but always hade enough oil on the underside...............i assume it was dripping while driving...............but this year is the first time its dripped in the garage.

Dont know for sure what rear main was used in 2007, but in 2010 it was the best gasket graphite gasket seal..............this year the one piece bop gasket also with the one piece oil pan gasket.............dont want to pull this motor again and try again with it...................im thinking something is wrong with it one way or the other.................its not like im having some hacks put this thing together...........2 builders from the forum, and one from green lake wi...............this is the one who said, im real familar with the bop one pic gasket..............he also said the smoke test showed no issues...................needless to say i wont be seeing him again..........

Rich

I guess no one told the web site people that they, "Butler", dropped LS engines:

https://butler-ls.com/

The link works just fine BTW.........:D

They also occasionally still have YouTube videos of LS builds

So it sounds like mainly oil in the inspection cover area. Is the starter covered in oil?

This is the same area my engine leaked from. There were actually multiple leaks in the following areas.

1. Oil Pan U Channel (main was and remains dry)
2. Back of both valve covers
3. Fuel Pump gasket

The fuel pump area will leak, run along the oil pan rails, then leak onto the starter and into the inspection area. That can go overlooked.

Jason, thanks for that info................both of my valve covers look good, no oil anywhere on them..............i will double check the fuel pump gasket, i did use silicone on the bolts to the pump................gonna get the car up in the air some in the next day or two and see if i can get a better pic of whats going on...................i have a robb mc mini starter, maybe a drop or two near it...............thought that might be coming from the inspection cover while flywheel is throwing stuff around.............im getting a little oil on the ps header while im driving................i can smell that....................think my oil filter adapter might be cracked...................i have the kre alum adapter on there , pretty old piece, seems every year im cranking the oil filter tighter and tighter on that thing, so thats a part of the issue.

Still doing some experiments with this drip stuff.....................think i will start a new thread on that, otherwise this gets too confusing adding to this thread.

Rich

Butlers LS website is still up and running I was just looking at it a couple days ago.

Here’s my take, I could be wrong. There’s more money in doing LS motors, only real money in a Pontiac hobby is selling rotating assembly kits. Heads etc. specially as the majority using stock blocks. The availability of stock blocks and what you have to go through to make sure it’s a good block. I had a friend call recently they told him 9 months or better before they could even consider giving him a price. They have real good video of the whole process to go through to check out a stock block. It’s very time consuming and labor intense. VS dealing with aftermarket block.