[Steve Barcak]

Pittsburgh- I have pulled both a '60 389 and a '55 287 out in the last few days, both autos, and have torn them down. If you need pics or me to measure something, let me know.

Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only...no corporate nonsense!"

[stevep]

55-60 Pontiac blocks have the same bell housing bolt pattern.

[PITTSBURGH 64]

Thanks for the offer Steve.
I'm putting a plan together for my next car.
I think I want to run a 59-60 389 may be with an All Pontiac 4.5 forged crank and a dual range hydro in a 64 or 65 tempest, in primer with steel wheels. A budget build.
Looks like I'll need to get the register machined to fit the hydro. Or may be I'll just stay with the stock 3.75 crank.

[stevep]

Jeff,
I have a 60 motor in my shop without an intake that you can have if you come and get it. I'll even take you to the Polish part of town for some food. I'll also take you to the North End too.

[PITTSBURGH 64]

Skip the Polish food (too greasy) and you have a deal!

Are you by St.Theresa's with the big tower with the four points by any chance? I can't remember the name of it, but isn't there a nice little greasy spoon across the street and down the on corner from the church?

[BruceWilkie]

FWIW my sons 64 Bonnie Brougham 4 dr hardtop 60 fts in the low 1.9's with regular 235/75 14 radials. original 389 with 1970 #11 small valve heads(ported though) stock cam 1.65 rockers performer intake 600 edelbrock with all the 64 afb guts in it and cobbled 3 tube headers. His Super hydro is ungodly off the line tires stop spinning immediately when it hits second (he also installed a 3.08 posi he scored for $75.00) Car runs mid 8's in the eighth. Not bad for a luxo barge. Hes been thrashin this thing for 10 years now and it still is going strong. He also has a nitrous plate on it and has put up to a 150 shot to it and all is holding up. Guess these transmissions cant be all that bad even stock.

[stevep]

Originally Posted by PITTSBURGH 64

Skip the Polish food (too greasy) and you have a deal!

Are you by St.Theresa's with the big tower with the four points by any chance? I can't remember the name of it, but isn't there a nice little greasy spoon across the street and down the on corner from the church?

Jeff,
I don't know how I missed this, but where is St. Theresa's?

Are you saying that Italian foos is LESS greasy than Polish food????

[Steve Barcak]

I just found a guy on ebay selling copies of manuals for many vintage trans including the roto and the hydromatic. The hydramatic version is $50 and is 299 pages. For the ones out there in the know- is this a good buy?
I am thinking of buying one just out of curiousity.
The auctions are closing soon, his ebay name is morris948 if anyone wants to look him up.
thanks,
Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only.....no corporate nonsense!"

[Bill Hanlon]

Don't know if that is a good deal or not, but a number of these manuals are posted on www.tocmp.com. Biggest problem is finding them. When I did a site search for Hydra-Matic I only got 12 hits, most of which were early 50's Lincoln (Lincoln bought Hydra-Matics from GM from 49-54). So I spent a couple of hours in November scanning my copy of the "On-The-Car Adjustment Manual" for Dual Range Hydra-Matics and sent it to TheOldCarManualProject. The guy that runs it is way behind in posting new submissions. Since then another old GMC truck guy showed me that this manual was already posted here: http://chevy.tocmp.com/trans/4655hmt/index.html

If anyone needs a better copy let me know. I have better copies than those currently on TOCMP.

[Steve Barcak]

Would these manuals be my best source ( other than here ) to learn about these trans? Are regular annual Pontiac shop manuals a good source for this too?

Thanks, Steve Barcak www.pontiacheaven.org

"Real Pontiacs only...no corporate nonsense!"

[stevep]

The Factory Service Manual is OK but the actual Hydramatic manual is better and there are many different versions. That is a copy of a 58-60 GM manual. I would wait and find one for much less than $50.00, unless it has part #'s in it. It doesn't look like it is going to sell, so email him and ask if it has part #'s in it.

[BruceWilkie]

FWIW good part #s can often be found in old Motors labor guide manuals.(check your local library too.) 64 Motors service manual has some good info in it as well on hydramatics(general).

I just got off the phone with an older friend in upstate NY who specialized on hydramatics and the old chevy turboglides in the early 60's. Swears the Superhydro to be near bullet proof if set up right. Hasnt seen the insides of one since early 70's though. He's going to check his attic for manuals. He thinks he may have some performance pieces out in one of his sheds (and yes if his son never got to them he'll sell them). I'll post again on this if he has anything you guys might be interested in.

[PITTSBURGH 64]

Bruce, that would be interesting to see what he has. I want to learn how to rebuild them.

[stevep]

Jeff, They can't be that hard to rebuild if I can do it!!!

[PITTSBURGH 64]

Steve, your too modest!

I keep hearing from old timers how strong these trannys are and my experience proves this.
Like Bruce's kid, I had one in a 64 Bonneville with a dual quad 389 back in the seventies while in trade school. The shop instructor milled and ported the heads and intake in that 389 and it was very strong.
That tranny took so much abuse from my young ego driven right foot and never let me down.
I use to street race that car with back to back runs for hours and that tranny was just something I took for granted. I don't know what the compression was but that 389 would only run on Sunoco 260!

[stevep]

Jeff, the other thing about the Dual Coupling, is usually it just needs a soft part overhaul and maybe the coupling cover has cracked. The parts are very beefy.

[PITTSBURGH 64]

I see nos parts on E-bay from time to time for next to nothing and want to but them but I have no idea if I'll need them. It seems the old timers are dying off and there familys are selling there parts and these parts will dry up soon.

Is there a list of tools I should get before taking my first tranny apart?

[stevep]

Jeff,
I do not have any of the "special GM tools" for this trans, I just have the everyday trans shop tools. You will need a few different pairs of snap ring pliers and something to compress the return springs in the rear clutch drum. If it needs bushings, they can be done at a local trans shop unless you have something to accurately press them in. This trans is very forgiving to the bushings and the most common ones to replace are in the rear drum and tailhousing.

[60man]

Originally Posted by stevep

Jeff,
I have a 60 motor in my shop without an intake that you can have if you come and get it. I'll even take you to the Polish part of town for some food. I'll also take you to the North End too.

Ditto Jeff...I think I have a 60 motor you can have when you pick up trannys if you wish...
I was planning on scraping it..It's froze up..siezed...not the water kind..

[stevep]

Wow Jeff,
You are going to have a real good stock of 60 motors and transmissions....FREE!